Huh, I wonder if you could somehow make it so your computer asked you for a password before it installed any programs?

Eh, I guess that would be too hard to do.

A recent firmware update from Apple caused 1.6 G5s to freeze up and Panther erased user data on firewire drives. Macs don't need viruses, they have something much more deadly, Apple software.

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RealityCheck wrote:
A recent firmware update from Apple caused 1.6 G5s to freeze up and Panther erased user data on firewire drives. Macs don't need viruses, they have something much more deadly, Apple software.

Boy you are one sad case. Must feel awful knowing that every post you make is in the doghouse. Maybe the next Apple update will erase you.

Yeah, and what about SP2 which caused major applications to crash, or caused large numbers of Windows machines to run slower.
Note, the firewire drive, the G5 update and the OSX.2.8 update affected machines intermitently if at all.
Mine were always fine.
Is that the best you can do?

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Guest wrote:
Yeah, and what about SP2 which caused major applications to crash, or caused large numbers of Windows machines to run slower.
Note, the firewire drive, the G5 update and the OSX.2.8 update affected machines intermitently if at all.
Mine were always fine.
Is that the best you can do?

hedinbutt. I've updated many Macs and haven't lost a bit of data from the updates. By many. I mean 100-250 macs. The firewire problems were from bad firmware on the drives themselves. Blame those manufacturers. AND 88,000 virusses compared to that would still be minor league. WAKE UP AND SMELL THE CRAP that MS produces

1) "Once there was a 'bad' Mac update, so now we're even"
2) "There's no problem with Windows, it's the users, stupid!"

My own experience with Windows: one machine owned before I could patch it, another one had spyware on it despite never installing anything or ever visiting "suspect websites" hem-hem. Reaction of senior IT guy inbetween beers: "Yeah, that happens. Live with it or install something else."

Mind, I will always maintain that Dungeonkeeper is the coolest game and in itself worth buying a Windows machine, but it's a totally insecure OS, even when patched and closed as suggested.

BTW when you want windows users to talk about security and stability honestly, don't mention the mac...

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Guest wrote:

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Guest wrote:
Yeah, and what about SP2 which caused major applications to crash, or caused large numbers of Windows machines to run slower.
Note, the firewire drive, the G5 update and the OSX.2.8 update affected machines intermitently if at all.
Mine were always fine.
Is that the best you can do?

My Windows XP machine runs fine. Does that mean I win the prize for most ridiculous anecdote that proves absoltuely nothing at all xcept that I know what the hell I'm doing with a computer? Security problems on Windows are, for the most part, caused by people not following simple basics of computer security because it's too much effort. The two things that will stop most of these problems are to run a hardware firewall (especially if you're using broadband) and run an AV app, keeping the signatures up to date. I have not had ONE hack of my system and it runs 24/7 (runs IIS to serve my small website).

I actually have a G5 1.6 and a firewire harddrive. I updated the machine about a week ago with the new firmware. No problems to report. In fact the computer is working perfectly.

I'm guessing that either your information is not true, or it's an isolated case.

Andy

Frankly, I'm not surprised. Every day we hear about new Windows vulnerabilities. In fact, there is now an exploit where a Windows computer can be infected simply by viewing a maliciously formatted JPG image! Saw this article in news.com.com the other day:
http://news.com.com/Trojan+horse+exploits+image+flaw/2100-7355_3-5385995.html

It's only getting worse, I'm afraid.

Is he getting a percentage from the Cook Islands?

Why else would be be so eager to get everyone off Macs.

Just proves the old saying: Using Windows on the internet is about as safe as having unprotected sex in a Calcutta whorehouse. (My apologies to Mac users in Calcutta . . .)

Ihave a lot of friends in IT works, all under Windows... and not one of them ever saw a stable windows system that did not require a lot of tinkering by the owner... and that's not how a machine should beheave... any machine...

couple of months ago in my office (we do translations) a virus infected all the internal network despite firewalls and It guys always keeping everything under control... and know what? I took my old G3 ibook from under the desk (I use it to backup anything I'm working on) and continued to work happy as a hippo... that week I was the only one on schedule... and I'm not even going to imagine how bad was for the company itself in terms of money lost to customers and money for the cleaning of the system...

Lucky me I have a Mac...

Cheers

Fact: most corporations that get infected by a virus/worm are caused by laptop users taking their systems home and using them and bringing them back into the office and connecting to the network.

Conclusion: you can have all of the hardware/software firewalls you cram onto your network. Unless these users are equally safe at home on the internet, it means nothing.

These criminals want to attack the largest group of people possible which is why the majority of them do not target Macs. The market share is too low.

And I do know what I'm talking about. I'm a software engineer for a Fortune 200 company and was the Mac Admin for a pre media center for RR Donnelley before they closed up and moved.

This is directed to the Guest XP user who said he never had a problem. Did you have to buy Anti-Virus? I bet you did. I don't have an Anti-Virus program on my Mac's. Did you get a Spyware program? I have no need for one. Windows Fanatics crack me up.

Please, for your safety and as a courtesy to others....

DON'T FEED THE TROLLS.

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Guest wrote:
This is directed to the Guest XP user who said he never had a problem. Did you have to buy Anti-Virus? I bet you did. I don't have an Anti-Virus program on my Mac's. Did you get a Spyware program? I have no need for one. Windows Fanatics crack me up.

Actually it was third parties who took shortcuts with their firmware. That would explain why the third paties issued the fixes. Apple provided a temporary work around. More FUD from a real PUD!

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Guest wrote:

I used a Mac at an old job (OS 9) and a virus was somehow burned to a Lotus disc we had and it wiped the entire system just by putting the disc in the drive. I recall having to run AV apps on Mac OS 6-9. Don't tell me Macs are virus free. It's only a matter of time before Mac OS X gets hit with a virus.

I have been a Mac user for more than 10 years. In fact, I am currently running an upgraded Graphite G4 with a 1.4 gHz processor in it. Also, I have anti-virus software installed. I update it monthly, and have it running all the time.

Why, you may ask, if OS X has not virii, do I have anti-virus software? Because I have quite a few Windows using friends I email regularly, and they have sent me virus-ridden emails in the past that I have not caught, and then sent on to my other Windows using friends. It did not affect me one bit, but it hit them fairly hard. Therefore, I use AV software for those of my friends that have not switch to the Mac yet. Every single virus def is for a Windows trojan horse, macro, or other virus.

Of course, if I stopped using it, maybe they would switch sooner.

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Guest wrote:
My Windows XP machine runs fine. Does that mean I win the prize for most ridiculous anecdote that proves absoltuely nothing at all xcept that I know what the hell I'm doing with a computer? Security problems on Windows are, for the most part, caused by people not following simple basics of computer security because it's too much effort. The two things that will stop most of these problems are to run a hardware firewall (especially if you're using broadband) and run an AV app, keeping the signatures up to date. I have not had ONE hack of my system and it runs 24/7 (runs IIS to serve my small website).

Dear, JtuckerJX, in the mac os 6 to 9 era there were several mac viruses, and some of them created considerable damage. I have had mac os 7,8 and 9, and the operating system was as vulnerable as Windows at the same time. There were less viruses only because virus writers would not bother with a niche product, but would rather write viruses that can do more damage. You always target windows, because you can hit more users.

And, of course, the windows viruses could not infect a mac.

Now, in the os x era, the situation is a bit different. because of the way it is conceived, a unix operating system is less prone to viruses. it is much more difficult to write programs that exploit security flaws and induce damage to a user. This, together with the smaller market share of Mac OS X, makes this platform less insecure. But, technically, virus writers could still target the mac, and some of them might succeed.

> Security problems on Windows are, for the most part, caused by
> people not following simple basics of computer security because
> it's too much effort.

Funny, you've just described just about any Windows user I know!

Your so-called basics of computer security are the equivalent of fine-tuning your cars airbags. You can do as much damage as good, if you don't know exactly what you are doing. Computers are not supposed to work this way...

Windows is vulnerable. OSX is vulnerable. The diffrence is that Apple is pro-active in patching the holes. OSX is not immune to viruses, and anyone who tells you otherwise is a fool.

Anyone involved in this issue enough to post here knows this to be true: getting people to admit a mistake is hard to do. They also know that Windows is DESIGNED to have security flaws, where executable files received by email or browser cache or elsewhere have the ability to affect the operating system without user knowledge or input.

This back door, mostly there to allow Big Brother Bill to monitor OS/SW piracy is so obvious a fault that I cannot imagine why an industry so impacted by billions in virus management costs doesn't sue the bejeezus out of said Big Bro. It's not just bad design, but PURPOSELY bad design built for profit, and those profits are externalized to the entire industry, and the unsuspecting public.

But despite being massively more vulnerable, this does not fully explain why aside from a few Word macro viruses I have NEVER seen one on any of the dozens of Mac's I've had in almost 20 years. What DOES explain it is the ire many have about Big Bro in Redmond. Jobs & Co. go way out of their way, take a lot of risks, make a few mistakes, and generally wow the crap out of people by providing hardware and OS updates that do little or nothing to insult our intelligence, our desire for beautiful, elegant equipment, and even our pocketbook, when all costs are considered.

When your users love you with something akin to fanatacism, and nonusers have to at least aknowledge an inner lust for things like my aluminum powerbook doing things they only dream of... well, we're not only NOT targets, we're what they strive to protect. Shoot, macs are WORTH protecting!

Lastly, I don't expect anyone to switch because I say this. Considering people are willing to send they're children to die in causes so bankrupt as Iraq rather than acknowledge a mistake, I'm not holding my breath.

peace.

First of all nobody sends there children to die anywhere. Our troops are all adults and joined on there own free will. I guess you don't give a dam about millions of iraqis who now have a chance at freedom, to buy a mac, or whine about there government like you do. Under saddam, you would get your tounge cut out...if you were lucky.

Windows. WINDOWS! If you want to argue about politics, go to the WN/P/P forums. This is not the place.

Your post, unfortunately falls on - not deaf ears, but ears listening to Britney Spears, Patriotism-spouting, headlight-blinded Political speeches and other irrelevant, attention-diverting, noise.

Is M$ a company that has 60 BILLION dollars in the bank that can't or won't make their OS software secure?

Is it: can't because it's too big a friggin' mess; or won't because there's no INCENTIVE to.

If there's no incentive, is it because NO ONE can force M$ to make it secure - thus they'll leave their spyfriendly 'OS' open; or because there's no money to be made fixing it. (Unless M$ follows though with M$ AV

Am I smart enough to fool you? Am I smart enough to not be fooled?

You run IIS and you say your machine has NEVER been hacked. Ignorance must be bliss

Sure is.

Imagine the fame someone would gain by making a virus for OSX.

"No one targets Macs cause no one uses 'em - otherwise it's almost as vunerable as Windows!"

Pfft. Much of hacker culture is based on ego. You'd be famous if you created a succesful virus for the Mac. Macs are just more secure.