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Steve Jobs Interview: Microsoft, Innovation, Apple, Mac Loyalty, More

Steve Jobs Interview: Microsoft, Innovation, Apple, Mac Loyalty, More

by , 1:30 PM EDT, October 12th, 2004

BusinessWeek has published one of the best interviews we have yet read with Apple CEO Steve Jobs. The interview covers a wide variety of topics including the nature of innovation (several themes regarding that), what happened to Apple in the early and mid 1990s, how Apple works today, what Mr. Jobs finds important, the nature of Mac loyalty (hint: it's not the "church of Mac") and more.

In the following excerpt, for instance, Steve Jobs talks about how companies innovate, and what happens to them after that initial innovation. Perhaps more interestingly, he illustrates his point by using Microsoft as an example. From the interview:

Q: What can we learn from Apple's struggle to innovate during the decade before you returned in 1997?
A: You need a very product-oriented culture, even in a technology company. Lots of companies have tons of great engineers and smart people. But ultimately, there needs to be some gravitational force that pulls it all together. Otherwise, you can get great pieces of technology all floating around the universe. But it doesn't add up to much. That's what was missing at Apple for a while. There were bits and pieces of interesting things floating around, but not that gravitational pull.

People always ask me why did Apple really fail for those years, and it's easy to blame it on certain people or personalities. Certainly, there was some of that. But there's a far more insightful way to think about it. Apple had a monopoly on the graphical user interface for almost 10 years. That's a long time. And how are monopolies lost? Think about it. Some very good product people invent some very good products, and the company achieves a monopoly.

But after that, the product people aren't the ones that drive the company forward anymore. It's the marketing guys or the ones who expand the business into Latin America or whatever. Because what's the point of focusing on making the product even better when the only company you can take business from is yourself?

So a different group of people start to move up. And who usually ends up running the show? The sales guy. John Akers at IBM (IBM ) is the consummate example. Then one day, the monopoly expires for whatever reason. But by then the best product people have left, or they're no longer listened to. And so the company goes through this tumultuous time, and it either survives or it doesn't.

Q: Is this common in the industry?
A: Look at Microsoft (MSFT ) -- who's running Microsoft?

Q: Steve Ballmer.
A: Right, the sales guy. Case closed. And that's what happened at Apple, as well.

There is much, much more in the two page interview, which we recommend as a very interesting read no matter your opinion of Apple.

The Mac Observer Spin:

We also enjoyed Mr. Jobs' take on why Mac users are so loyal to the Mac. He talks about the joy of using a Mac (read the interview for his full comments), and points out that you can't get the kind of end-to-end quality you get with a Mac on any other computer. Lots of folks try to belittle Mac users as cultists, but Mr. Jobs has it right in his take.

We'd very much like to hear your opinions of the interview in the comments below.

Observer Comments

Show: Subjects Only | Full Comments
Close Name:jimothy Posts: 612 Joined: 04 Jun 2004
Subject: Credit where credit is due

BusinessWeek should note that Steve Jobs co-founded Apple, along with Steve Wozniak. The third paragraph says Jobs founded Apple. Note that Jobs himself does mention Wozniak.

Close Name:Billy K Posts: 297 Joined: 06 May 2004
Subject: A Humbler Steve?

I like his tone in this interview.

He's right in everything he says (must fight RDF). I very much want an iPhone, and I would love to see Apple (re)enter the PDA market, but like he says, what would be Apple's "significant" contribution" to these markets?

I also like his take on why Apple struggled in the 90s. too many sales guys; Apple forgot who they were.

Welcome back, iLeader.

P.S. I also like how he gives credit to HP.

Close Name:kenaustus Posts: 602 Joined: 27 Jun 2003
Subject: He's right . . .

about why people love their Macs after switching. I'm one of them - switched 2+ years ago with a PB for business travel and the delivery of a 20" G5 iMac last month was the final piece for a full switch for work & home.

To say "it just works" doesn't focus on all the areas where it does just work. Mal-ware was a killer for me and many others. Depending on a computer for running my business was critical. Opening new areas where I can enjoy playing around - digital pics & movies (I'm now a grandpa), dozens of small apps I would never trust on a PC, enjoying music in a new way from iTunes (with Creature speakers at work) to iPods. Hell, even the one proprietary Windows app can be run on VPC and XP is actually more stable on the Mac than on a PC.

All this is because of the focus that Jobs has brought back to Apple. It shows in the interview. More importantly, while I read the article I kept thinking that there are very few companies that can match Apple's focus. The comments were therefore not so important when thinking about Apple as when thinking about other companies.

It was, as always, a pleasure to read Steve's comments. He is one of the most important minds in the business world today and I continue to be most impressed with him.

Close Name:John F. Braun -   TMO Staff Posts: 233 Joined: 11 Jun 2001
Subject: Why Apple and Mac Rock

My favorite quote from this interview concerns why Mac users are so loyal:

"I get asked a lot why Apple's customers are so loyal. It's not because they belong to the Church of Mac! That's ridiculous. [Take note, RC]

It's because when you buy our products, and three months later you get stuck on something, you quickly figure out [how to get past it]. And you think, "Wow, someone over there at Apple actually thought of this!" And then three months later you try to do something you hadn't tried before, and it works, and you think "Hey, they thought of that, too." And then six months later it happens again. There's almost no product in the world that you have that experience with, but you have it with a Mac. And you have it with an iPod."

I've experience this "ah ha" moment with Apple products time and time again. As an engineer by training, I can appreciate the work that has gone into all major operating systems, Windows included. But where the Mac and other Apple products shine is in the human-centered design and plain elegance. To me, requiring a manual to figure out how to work something is a design failure.

One statement (I think it was from a past edition of The Mac Bible) that I think sums up how Apple thinks when it designs products is "Easy is hard. Hard is easy." In other words, it is easy to just throw something together and let the user figure it out, or feel like an idiot when they can't. It takes true talent to design a product that most people can figure out without breaking out the dreaded manual.

Close Name:Guest
Subject: Interview

Great interview. I think Mr. Jobs has hit the nail on the head. When you focus on making great products, having a passion for making great products, then making a profit will happen. Too often companies do lose sight of the things that made them successful. Look at HP now, or even look at Sony. Without Morita's leadership, Sony isn't quite the company they used to be. However, I also think that Mr. Jobs had to leave "his baby" do Next and Pixar to reagain the focus he has. I truly like Apple products because they just work!

Close Name:Mav Posts: 1320 Joined: 17 Oct 2003
Subject:

This interview will leave other CEOs either looking on in awe or quaking in their boots (depending on the industry ). Steve shows he's an experienced, focused, level-headed, AND hip tech veteran. He's probably never been a more dangerous competitor. You gotta love it.

Close Name:les aptt Posts: 221 Joined: 19 Nov 2003
Subject: Interesting, Very interesting...

Mr. Jobs talks about focus and how easly success can "dilute" it, and how other forces come to power
Quote:

"Q: What's the CEOs role in all of this?
A: I don't know. Head janitor?"

I love his response for there are two ways to read it. Read it as "head JANITOR", its cute and flippant. Read it as "HEAD janitor" and it fits.

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