Want some cheese with that whine?

Apple has gotten too big. Time to break them up into separate companies before they become like Microsoft.

If you were losing money and had to go out of business due to Apple being shady, I bet you'd be a bit pissed off too. Somehow I doubt these people would file a lawsuit if most of the accusations weren't true. Good luck to them. They deserve to be compensated.

HAHAHA - um, people file false lawsuits all the time.

The complaint was written by lawyers who are probably working for a percentage of the profits, er, award. They can write anything they want and at 26 pages they probably threw in everything, including the kitchen sink.

Resellers do face a challenge these days. They are between the mass merchants that receive much higher traffic and the Apple Stores, which are setting new standards in computer retailing. While there are some good ones there have also been a lot of posts about resellers with crummy stores and poor customer service.

End result:

Customers will probably get a $25 coupon against their next Apple purchase.
Resellers will get written assurance that they will get deliveries at the same rate as the Apple Stores as long as they pay their invoices by the due date and the lawyers will make millions.

All too often lawyers(and for that matter,the police ,prosecutors etc., go after "all they can see and findd" but then let the courts s"sort it out" which certainly places a burden on the legal process. That's what seeems to be happening here.

In fact, I live around the corner from Macadam in SF. They, in a word, suck. Poor customer service, incredible prices, arrogant attitudes--and I am an IT manager for a Mac based law firm. I'm glad they went under--it was a poor store, a bad representation of what the macintosh is all about. I gladly shop at the apple store in SF, where the staff are friendly and helpful, the attitude is positive, and teh presentation is superb. Good ridance to all those resellers who did nothing for the mac for many a long year.

And 2 cheers for the good resellers (like PowerMax in Portland!) who continue their tradition of good customer service, cheap prices, etc, and continue to have a good relationship with apple.

The federal legislation is designed to curtail class actions, not make them easier. No one has been lying in wait for the act to become law. If anything, you would expect class action attorneys to try to get thier suits filed before the laws effective date so that they could more easily certify a nationwide class.

"The suit says damages and losses to the three consumers in the case "do not exceed US$75,000."

The legal fees will be more than $75,000 alone. Who is funding this lawsuit? BG, M$, or Apple to get more free press?

... since I worked at Apple (early 1980s). Some of these same practices were going on then. I see little has changed since then. I'm not really surprised.

"And 2 cheers for the good resellers (like PowerMax in Portland!) who continue their tradition of good customer service, cheap prices, etc, and continue to have a good relationship with apple."

I think you have no real basis to make this assertion. You think Apple is so saintly that it's taken it upon itseld to systematically push out bad dealers? Let's say "mobbing" the crummy dealers?

You know that's a crime if it's true. There are probably mature, legal recourses apple could take to cut loose those sleazier dealers we've all been exposed to.

I guess I don't know why five people constitute a "class". Whether Apple's actions were illegal or not is up to the system. These 5 people may indeed have legitimate grievances against Apple. We won't know until the trial. It just p****s me off when some group wants to paint me and others as part of their class (in this case Apple's Consumers) so they stand a better chance of hitting the lottery. I wasn't harmed, most of Apples customers weren't harmed, most people weren't harmed by Apples alleged actions. Yet apparently from the text of the article these five individuals from across the country are presenting themselves as the leads in a consumer class action.

Five pissed off people aren't a "class".

Well, the complaints against Apple a real und understandable. While selling used machines may have been an exception, their business practices are not. They just as mean, dirty and unethical as possible. In other words, they are modern business practices. Apple is 'good' because it has good products, better ones than their rivals. Other than that (ethically that is), Apple is no bit better than Microsoft. They cheat, lie, bully ... use unfair methods. Look at the latest law suits initiated by Apple against rumor sites. Do they care about freedom of press? Do they care about 'enthusiasts'. No. I'm saying this because it's so funny how some ppl seem to think that Apple is somehow morally superior to any other company.

Well, whether they're a class is for the court to decide. They've filed a motion requesting, among other things, that the court certify the class, which means that the judge recognizes that there are many parties with essentially the same issue to litigate.

Basically, the MacAdam guy doesn't want to own up to the facts: he did a lousy job and when the customers in SF got the choice of going to the Apple retail store instead of MacAdam, they voted with their dollars.

If this farce ever gets to court, I sure hope a few of the people who've complained about Mac Adam over the years show up on the witness list. I'd pay to watch that show!

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Guest wrote:
If you were losing money and had to go out of business due to Apple being shady, I bet you'd be a bit pissed off too. Somehow I doubt these people would file a lawsuit if most of the accusations weren't true. Good luck to them. They deserve to be compensated.

What if they went out of business because they just sucked? Santos says it was all Apple's fault, but I've seen enough messages from his former customers to take anything he says with a grain of salt.

Funny part is that you don't seem to hearr the online Macc retailers complaining, MacZone,CDW,MacConnection etc. What you do hear is the "specialist" shopws of which there are two near where I am.

Both SUCK. Arrogant and more concerned with thingss not tthe walk-in customer. High Repari rates and so on.

If these guys are like the onees I've seen, wee're bett off without them.

I used to work for a VAR here in Southern California. Would I take my own products back there definately not. Cyber3 or I think they changed their name to "The Mac Shoppe" here is by far the worst dealer. They always fail to repair the problem correctly the first time. Their prices just suck, and they are arrogant assholes. Now I have a consulting business and am a member of the Apple Consultants Network, I know quality and VARs with the exception of a FEW!!!! are horrible and paint a poor face for Apple products. The VAR I used to work for didn't even have a demo model of every Mac for customers to play with and make a good decision.... just an outdated 233 Bondi Blue iMac when the machines were at 600MHz.... The Apple Stores are much better and if customers only had to deal with shitty VARs like Cyber3/"the mac shoppe" and no one would want to buy a computer from them when they can go to a much nicer storefront like BestBuy or CompUSA (not a fan of them just saying their presentation tends to be much better...) and buy something that looks like it's quality not a sleazy alley transation.... please if these guys are suing it's most likely because their business practices suck... would you buy a Ford from "Rent-A-Wreck" or a Mercedes Benz from a sleazy dealership? Do you think Mercedes-Benz would want you to buy a benz from that sleazy dealership? Please people it's business.

LOL

Sorry but apple deserves this is they were selling used machines as new. I'd be upset apple admitted after I bought my machine "new" and was infact used. They would have two choices. One. they could send me a truely new machine, or I would personally sue them. Yes there is the court costs etc... but really who cares. Even if I ended up loosing money, it's all about the principal.

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Guest wrote:
Sorry but apple deserves this is they were selling used machines as new.

That is an unsubstantiated allegation.

"Sorry but apple deserves this is they were selling used machines as new."

Typo, is should read if. If being the key word here.

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Anonymous wrote:

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Guest wrote:
Sorry but apple deserves this is they were selling used machines as new.

That is an unsubstantiated allegation.

After doing a bit more research, it appears I have been wrong about these comments. Apple was selling used machines as new.

I used to go to Weingarten Gallery...what a worthless piece of crap store that was!

They treated customers like an interruption, never had any current items in stock, and just sucked! I'm glad they went out of business, and I hope they lose their lawsuit!

I'm no legal expert, but I find it odd that they're wrapping all these plaintiffs into a single lawsuit. It seems like they're addressing two completely different types of complaints from two completely different types of plaintiffs.

If Apple was sending out used or refurbished equipment as new, then yes, that's a practice that should be stopped, and they can be slapped on the wrists pretty hard for it.

If -- IF -- Apple was tinkering with their third party resellers' supply chain in a way that was in fact an illegal business practice, that seems like a totally different issue. Complicating matters is the very conspicuous fact that it seems like it's only the third-party stores who had poor business practices and customer service records themselves making these claims; all the more reputable resellers seem to be competing and getting along well enough, suggesting that maybe the resellers in the lawsuit are just trying to blame Apple for their own shortcomings.

But again ... why these two different matters are being folded into one lawsuit, I don't know. Maybe the resellers feel that if they bundle their case in with a more legitimate one they'll have a better chance at winning, even if the cases are ultimately unrelated.

Mac idolators get what they deserve. Just because the box is new doesn't mean your Mac is. The Mac you buy could be someone else's headaches. Why don't you guys help each other out. When you return you busted Mac, scratch your initials and date in an inconspicuous spot, so the next victim will know he's bought an iLemon.

i live in london in England, although i bougt my mini ipod in New York. the legal case just gone through in america states that aplle has to repair all ipods in the US. does that include me bacause i bought it there? because the store in Regent Street London won't repair it because it has "cosmatic damage" i.e a scratch on the side. the problem is with the battery not holing its charge, surely that has nothing to do with apperence?

I got a macbook i was sure had been opened, but the store gave it to me in my hand, was in plastic and all, yet when i took it home it had scratches!

i tried calling apple, i got it in spain since i go to school here for another year, and guess what, calling them was a nightmare full of denials.

how would you like to get someone a gift for 1400€ only to find it was a refurbished computer., you apple geeks think its ok to allow apple to do whatever they want, well its wrong and illegal, apple should NOT sell refurbished macs at full prices.

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Anonymous wrote:
I got a macbook i was sure had been opened, but the store gave it to me in my hand, was in plastic and all, yet when i took it home it had scratches!

i tried calling apple, i got it in spain since i go to school here for another year, and guess what, calling them was a nightmare full of denials.

how would you like to get someone a gift for 1400€ only to find it was a refurbished computer., you apple geeks think its ok to allow apple to do whatever they want, well its wrong and illegal, apple should NOT sell refurbished macs at full prices.

If you didn't buy it in an Apple store, then your argument is most likely with the store you bought it from. What is to prevent THEM from selling you a "used" machine as new? Considering the only "plastic" they are wrapped in from the factory is the thin, white sleeve with the label holding it closed (which is easy to close again without making it look like it had ever been opened).

If the box it came in was shrinkwrapped, then the store did that themselves. The boxes come from Apple with only a small, round piece of clear tape holding the lid closed.