North Americans and German Speaking People View Apple Differently
North Americans and German Speaking People View Apple Differently
by , 1:45 PM EST, February 1st, 2007
North American customers and those in the German speaking countries appear to have a different view of Apple without Steve Jobs at the helm after he retires. That was the surprising result of an iDelphi poll published on Thursday.
Both North American and German speaking customers were asked two questions:
1. When will Steve Jobs retire from his position as Apple's CEO?
2. Would you view Apple differently without Steve Jobs running the company?
While the years 2010 and 2012 came up most often for both groups on the retirement question, the surprising results were that most German speaking customers did not expect to change their view on Apple after Mr. Jobs leaves while the North Americans would.
The report explained the tentative results: "What is surprising, however, is the fact that North-American users seem more influenced by the person Steve Jobs in their views on Apple, while German-speaking users seem to rely less on him in their view on Apple....
One explanation could be the fact that in these countries, Apple was historically perceived as a supplier to creative professionals, not as a company being attracting to consumers. As a result, "die hard Apple fans" in Austria, Germany, and Switzerland might still connect more to the products rather than the company itself."
Observer Comments
Thu Feb 01, 2007 3:00 pm Subject:
"One explanation could be the fact that in these countries, Apple was historically perceived as a supplier to creative professionals, not as a company being attracting to consumers. As a result, "die hard Apple fans" in Austria, Germany, and Switzerland might still connect more to the products rather than the company itself."
Another is that outside of the US, consumers are not as hysterical and have a tendency to take a more balance sophisticated view of things. Steve Jobs is a genius, but there's no reason for the vast majority of Apple product users to change their view of the company without him. I don't think it has anything to do with "die hard Apple fans" in Europe, and more to do with the fact the he is not a cultural phenomenon to non-Americans, but merely a clever man who they may admire, but certainly don't worship.
FWIW, Mac market share in Switzerland is very high, and it is rising fast in Germany too.
The US does seem to drift from one Cult of Personality to another. Jobs ain't Apple any more than Gates was MS or Henry was Ford. They may have started their respective enterprises but after a while the enterprise goes on regardless.
I'm wondering why so may seem to think Jobs will retire in 3-5 years. He isn't that old and he seems to enjoy running Apple. IMO Jobs will stay where he is until he starts making mistakes and then will be gently pushed into retirement by the board. I could see him at Apple another 10-25 years, if not 20.
Jobs "ain't Apple any more than Gates was MS or Henry was Ford"?
1. Call the grammar Nazi's
2. uh, on what do you base this assumption?
3. You make this statement the day after Kevin Rollins leaves Dell in its worst situation in decades and Michael Dell returns to the helm to salvage a floundering company (kind of the same way Jobs returned to Apple and Gates has thrust himself back into the spotlight eventhough he's NOT running Microsoft per se).
Thu Feb 01, 2007 3:58 pm Subject: Hairsplitter to nitpicker
Tiger, since you're already calling for proper grammar, you may want to use proper grammar when doing it:
"Call the grammar Nazi's"... what? I assume you wanted say "Call the grammar Nazis" (not just one grammar Nazi; several, or many of them). What you wrote was an unfinished sentence. If finished, it would perhaps sound "Call the grammar Nazi's sister" (for example).
Isn't it really poor English when people use possessive form (i.e. noun, followed by apostrophe, followed by 's') when they mean plural (noun, followed by 's', or sometimes 'es')...? Then, again, who am I to judge; I didn't learn English until I was in high school. I should better leave judging to those who speak it from birth.
I think, plain and simple, that Steve Jobs can be considered the Walt Disney of Apple. He really demonstrates the same desire to shape and guide the entire image, quality, and offerings of The Company. Walt didn't draw the cartoons-- but he hired the people who he thought would best do the job he wanted. Steve Jobs seems to operate in much the same way at Apple.
Yes, this confirms my impression that Americans tend to worship "heroes" while I'd say the Germans cured themselves for that in their relatively recent past. In addition to that, my impression is also that whatever problems Apple has, is actually related to the same phenomenon, as one personality is allowed to premeate the entire ambience of a corporation.
I've read stories on how Gates' colleagues used to sit rocking together with him since he had that weird habit!
I would hope that we would see a new player appear in these markets, coming from Europe. It would have been interesting to see whether the corporative culture would have been any different. How many links Ollila with Nokia, for instance? Who is the CEO of Sony Ericsson?
Quotegeoduck wrote:
The US does seem to drift from one Cult of Personality to another. Jobs ain't Apple any more than Gates was MS or Henry was Ford. They may have started their respective enterprises but after a while the enterprise goes on regardless.
I'm wondering why so may seem to think Jobs will retire in 3-5 years. He isn't that old and he seems to enjoy running Apple. IMO Jobs will stay where he is until he starts making mistakes and then will be gently pushed into retirement by the board. I could see him at Apple another 10-25 years, if not 20.
Steve had pancreatic cancer, albeit one that is rare and treatable. Even still, that second, rare form has an average life expectency of 5 years.
If Steve is an average man physically he may not be long for Apple.
QuoteGuest wrote:
Silly comment really.
Not really.
Henry ran Ford until his retirement. Then Ford has gone on just fine. MS is running just fine without Gates involved in day to day operations. Sure he sticks his nose in for this and that but others have taken most of the load. The same will be true of Apple after Jobs. Apple will continue without him.
The opposite would be a place like my folks shop. When they retired and sold it to someone else, it was closed within two years. My folks were the heart and soul of the place and it could not continue without them, no matter how hard the new owners tried. Customers went elsewhere, suppliers that would give Ralph and Ruth an extra few percent, or expedite an order when needed would not do that for the new guys. The personal relationship between them and my folks evaporated the minute they walked out the door.
When you're talking about a large publicly traded corporation like Apple, one person, no matter how high a profile or important to the creation of the company, is indispensable.
QuoteGuest wrote:
Steve had pancreatic cancer, albeit one that is rare and treatable. Even still, that second, rare form has an average life expectency of 5 years.
If Steve is an average man physically he may not be long for Apple.
Oh yeah, that's right. I had forgotten about the cancer. That could very well shorten things.
Thu Feb 01, 2007 4:37 pm Subject: I hope it doesn't change
Of course Jobs isn't going to be around forever. Although I tend to think that Apple will change fundamentally when he leaves, there is some hope.
I work for a company that was started by one man 95 years ago. The principles that he started the company on are still the core values today. And the company is still growing, and doing quite well with about 5000 regular employees.
I think it will be different because Apple is in the technology sector. I feel that Apple has done so well because of Steve's ability to visualize innovation. They've been working on the iPhone for 2.5 years already. They didn't announce it until it was just right. And it will ship when it is ready. How many prototypes did they have that didn't make it? How many other companies have the ability to hold off and sit on a product like that?
How I see it (and you may disagree, I could be wrong): Steve is a perfectionist (don't ask what happened to AppleTV) and the products that Apple puts out show it. Shareholders trust him to release valid, marketable products when they are ready.. not when they are first conceived. If Dell had been working on an iPhone type product, it would have been known long ahead of time and their shareholders would have been clawing at the CEO (of the day) to release it.
I do fear the day Steve leaves. But it is possible for Apple to continue as they are today. It will take a lot of discipline, but it is possible.
Thu Feb 01, 2007 7:16 pm Subject: RDF depends on language
1. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grammar_nazi
2. Maybe the answer is that English speakers/listeners are more easily caught up in Steve's RDF. I am sure that he is not as effective when being translated into Deutsche.
QuoteGuest wrote:
I thought all German's where Nazis....but what do I know, I'm an "hysterical" American.
Did you know that Hitler is not Germany's king anymore? He's dead.
Just kidding. But it's truly amazing what Americans "know" about Germany. They regularly do a hell of a job to ruin their image. At least most of us get that George W. Bush is your president and not Kennedy.
And btw his keynote is available on iTunes Germany in English only. Who would translate and dub that?
QuoteTommo_UK wrote:
Another is that outside of the US, consumers are not as hysterical and have a tendency to take a more balance sophisticated view of things.
Oh please... I love how people stereotype Americans in whatever way they see fit. Seemingly to try to feel better about themselves.
QuoteGuest wrote:
But it's truly amazing what Americans "know" about Germany. They regularly do a hell of a job to ruin their image. At least most of us get that George W. Bush is your president and not Kennedy.
Considering he's the president of the most powerful country in the world, I wouldn't doubt it.
QuoteGuest wrote:
Steve had pancreatic cancer, albeit one that is rare and treatable. Even still, that second, rare form has an average life expectency of 5 years.
Untreated.
Jobs was successfully treated by surgery:
http://www.macobserver.com/article/2004/08/01.2.shtml
Ive's is great, but he runs a whole team of creative people. Accordingly, I suspect he can be replaced, and Apple would still come up with perhaps different, but still some great ideas. That is not to say he should be replaced, just that he could be.
Moreover, I read an interview with Ive's once. People probably forget, but he was at Apple in 1992, well before Jobs' 1997 return. This was even before Gil was still running the show. Nonetheless, we never heard his name until after Steve returned.
Ive's fairly credited Jobs' management stye and vision to his teams' ability to be able to do what they do. He said under Gil, and his predecessors, management would always be over their shoulders. They also did not recognize his talent. Moreover, after the iMac, Ive's could have worked anywhere. Yet, he stuck it out with Steve. Keep in mid after the iMac, Apple's rebound was not yet established.
Under Jobs, Ive's and his team are given the space to do what creative people do. Jobs also is the one who saw Ive's designs and promoted him to the head of the design department.
Accordingly, Steve should get credit for being able to recognize talent, and be able to foster it. Not everyone can. Apple's former CEO's certainly did not. Ive's had already designed a prototype of the iMac, but Gil was not interested.
QuoteWebsnap wrote:
Steve Jobs being gone would be a shame, Jonathan Ive being gone would be a travesty.
Actually Ford was a visionary, and Ford has not gone on just fine. Japanese companies are kicking its butt.
Ford understood that in order to sell cars, people had to have money to buy the cars. Accordingly, he came up with creative ideas for Ford customers to make money to be able to buy his product. For instance, he started using soybean made fabric for the interiors, so farmers could grow the soy beans, be paid, and be able to afford Ford trucks.
Nowadays, Ford makes a crappy product, and is laying off all the people who buy their product. They are unable to adapt to changing times. Under Henry's leadership, Ford will still be kicking butt.
Microsoft will continue without Gates, but Gates was hardly a visionary, just a smart business person.
Quotegeoduck wrote:QuoteGuest wrote:
Silly comment really.
Not really.
Henry ran Ford until his retirement. Then Ford has gone on just fine.
Oh yeah, that's right. I had forgotten about the cancer. That could very well shorten things.[/quote]
Quote
Considering he's [Bush] the president of the most powerful country in the world, I wouldn't doubt it.
I wouldn't trumpet the fact that we, supposedly the most powerful country in the world, voted for a moron twice to be our President.
Don't blame me though, I didn't vote for the imbecile.
Quotedeasys wrote:QuoteGuest wrote:
Steve had pancreatic cancer, albeit one that is rare and treatable. Even still, that second, rare form has an average life expectency of 5 years.
Untreated.
Jobs was successfully treated by surgery:
http://www.macobserver.com/article/2004/08/01.2.shtml
The article I read stated 5 years average life expectancy following successful treatment. I sincerely hope this is wrong... "Long Live His Steveness!"
Fri Feb 02, 2007 12:50 pm Subject: Look at Apple History
Look how much Apple has changed from CEO to CEO. When Sculley and company kicked Jobs out they made some serious changes in their strategic targets. Gil Amelio almost killed the company, and right before Jobs stepped back in Apple was licensing it's hardware designs to allow 3rd parties to produce Macintosh compatible computers.
I would be amazed if Apple did not change again after Jobs leaves/retires.
QuoteGuest wrote:Quote
Considering he's [Bush] the president of the most powerful country in the world, I wouldn't doubt it.
I wouldn't trumpet the fact that we, supposedly the most powerful country in the world, voted for a moron twice to be our President.
Don't blame me though, I didn't vote for the imbecile.
Haha yeah, I never said he was a GOOD president. Just stating the facts.
QuoteHenry ran Ford until his retirement. Then Ford has gone on just fine. MS is running just fine without Gates involved in day to day operations. Sure he sticks his nose in for this and that but others have taken most of the load. The same will be true of Apple after Jobs. Apple will continue without him.
(...)
When you're talking about a large publicly traded corporation like Apple, one person, no matter how high a profile or important to the creation of the company, is indispensable.
Aren't you contradicting yourself here? Meant to say one person is not indispensable?
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