B******S

Sums it up in one word

Secure as OS X has been to a point, I can wait. Gives those troubleshooters more time to make it even more solid.

The thing is, now Apple has time to fix that stupid cursor bug that people could use as a potential backdoor-oh wait, sorry I was thinking of someone else, Apple wouldn't be stupid enough for that to happen in the first place. They aren't perfect, but they aren't overconfident morons either, most of the time.

I'm honestly more bummed about this from a budgeting perspective than anything else, half my darn family has birthdays in October so its always a tight month for me.

First they delay, or completely ignore, upgrading the iPod by putting everything iPoders want into a phone and giving us nothing. Then they take the most anticipated OS ever and stick it in a closet while they spend more time and money working on a phone. I would hazard a guess that there are MANY more Mac enthusiasts looking forward to Leopard than there are people wanting to spend 600 bucks on a freakin' phone. On top of that, they stuck the phone with one carrier. I wouldn't switch cell service to AT&T if it was the only service available.

Apple has definitely fallen in my eyes. They don't give a crap about those of us who made them what they are today. Instead they're chasing some other market that by most predictions is a 50-50 shot at best. I've never wished bad things on them, but I'm so angry about this that I will now. I hope they loose their shirt on this stupid phone.

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Partsmutt wrote:
Apple has definitely fallen in my eyes. They don't give a crap about those of us who made them what they are today. Instead they're chasing some other market that by most predictions is a 50-50 shot at best.

So delaying until October is "only" a 4 month delay, not a 6 month delay.

Meanwhile, Australian's rejoice as Apple announces that "We meant Spring, Southern Hemisphere, didn't we say that? Oops, our bad."

reinharden

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Partsmutt wrote:
Then they take the most anticipated OS ever and stick it in a closet ...

I think most of these comments overreact to the news, as disappointing as any delay in anticipated products like Leopard can be to us all. Bottom line: we all want Apple to be a successful company that continues to push limits in technology in amazing ways, ways that few other companies have managed consistently. The iPod has been a fabulous contributor to Apple's current success, but it is largely a mature product. Think of the iPhone as the next generation of the iPod and competition with "smart phones" in the same package and it can be seen as a great business decision to out-march competitors. The truth is that Apple's successes have prompted a great many companies to attempt emulations; for Apple to continue to be profitable, it has to take risks and try new concepts that no one has dreamed of. In doing so, they tend to put together beautifully designed objects, not simply junk like the Zune. But they can't achieve perfection or satisfy everyone. Unless you're an Apple stockholder, and then you can see that a little patience with this company almost always pays off. I think it will this time, too. (And for those who don't like ATT/Cingular, tell me you love your phone company without reservation. That's not the kind of problem that will stop the iPhone from being successful in the long term.)

Humm..I was ready to drop some crazy money Apple's way to get a new MacBook Pro so I could get out of the Design studio with CS3 and a new OS, but I just may wait. I think putting all time and money to this iphone is terrible way to support your base that as been using Apple's computers since the 80's Also Apple needs to stop the new habit lately at Conferences and MacWorld to announce what is ideally vaperware, itv, iphone and now OS 10.5 let's just go back to "and just one more thing... "New product!!! and here it is!"

There's no official statement on Apple's PR page... this is a fake...

They're on a frigging death march. Unbelievable.

P.S. http://www.apple.com/hotnews/

I have been beta testing Leonard since day one. And the Apple side of development has been very slow. Common comment on the latest releases is that they are slow and flawed. I agree. I have been saying all along that Leopard is no where near ready for Spring. And here they have already killed 10.4.9 with the surgical sabotage that they did with Panther and we have to sit and suffer with what is becoming a piece of crap. Yes, there will be a 10.4.10, 11, 12 ,13 . . . .

Diverting attention to the iPhone release is a ploy to save face, as Apple has been doing a lot lately.

Oh. I stopped in to my Apple store and looked a the AppleTV connected to several (3 set-ups in a row) top-of-line SONY HDTVs and they looked horrible and no one would answer my questions as to what was the problem. Apple or SONY.

Keep up the mediocre work, Apple.

This is a good thing. They should take all the time they need to release quality products.


It's really No Big Deal.

Apple, unlike nearly every other company out there right now, offers a complete line of hardware products and software products. As a result, there have always been delays with Apple's products, sometimes months and months beyond when the product was originally out there. Anybody who thought that they were different from anyone else in that respect, I don't know where you got that impression, I know I've never heard any Apple mgmt types cite punctuality as one of their core values.

To those who fear the iPhone/AppleTV taking over Apple, that's kind of like being afraid of jewish people taking over Israel, that ship sailed so long ago some of us are starting to forget what its backside looked like. Not only that, but both the AppleTV and the iPhone are more than just iPods, they both run a fairly robust variant of OSX that make them potentially best-in-class devices on software alone. You see Apple abandoning MacOS, and I see the greatest way to spread the MacUI out to the masses since HyperCard.

the delay of Leopard to the FIVE years it took Vista to come out. Don't even try. And Apple usually announces products at least six months in advance of their release, so the iPhone announcement, trumpted in the media for two years now as coming, was just that. A six month lead time. Big woo. And judging by the interest, it will be a big seller. 1 million requests for it to AT&T in the first month, five months before it's release?

Consider this delay a small blessing. They're spending the time tweaking it.

People Biatch and Moan on this board quite often when new OS versions come out about the cost of upgrading to the next level OS. This just saves your cost a few more months so you can scrape together those pennies for a $99 release (or $69 if you're in education).

Vista cost HOW much????????????????????????????????????? I don't think I'll be getting that for the PC we have. Even after MS announces they're dumping XP in 2008 for good.

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Guest wrote:
I have been beta testing Leonard since day one. And the Apple side of development has been very slow. Common comment on the latest releases is that they are slow and flawed. I agree. I have been saying all along that Leopard is no where near ready for Spring. And here they have already killed 10.4.9 with the surgical sabotage that they did with Panther and we have to sit and suffer with what is becoming a piece of crap. Yes, there will be a 10.4.10, 11, 12 ,13 . . . .

Diverting attention to the iPhone release is a ploy to save face, as Apple has been doing a lot lately.

Oh. I stopped in to my Apple store and looked a the AppleTV connected to several (3 set-ups in a row) top-of-line SONY HDTVs and they looked horrible and no one would answer my questions as to what was the problem. Apple or SONY.


Keep up the mediocre work, Apple.

No, Harry, you cad, he has been testing "Leonard", not "Leopard". Leonard, for those that are unaware, doesn't have an NDA. It is only given as a diversion to trolls who think that Vista is fantastic, that so-called "intelligent design" is more logically consistant than evolution and that Iraq had the means to take out the rest of the world.

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LaurieF wrote:
No, Harry, you cad, he has been testing "Leonard", not "Leopard". Leonard, for those that are unaware, doesn't have an NDA. It is only given as a diversion to trolls who think that Vista is fantastic, that so-called "intelligent design" is more logically consistant than evolution and that Iraq had the means to take out the rest of the world.

I've spent some time with Vista Business this week installing software and such on my boss' new laptop. This delay really couldn't have come at a worse time. Vista's Aero interface feels pasted on and unfinished. Frankly, a five year development cycle for Vista is an embarassment for all involved. Apple really had a chance to show the buying public something new and fresh and diverted some marketshare in their direction.

Instead, they focused on a phone. Another blown opportunity.

Plus the Mac line up hasn't changed in months. The Mini is basically unchanged for a year! Apple needs to at the very least refresh some Mac models (I know the Mac Pro was just refreshed with basically all the same components).

The iPod also has stagnated.

This phone had better be worth Apple's lack of attention to core markets.

Fletch

Years ago on an Apple OS running on, ghast, the venerable 65816, the final relase of Apple IIGs's SSW 6 was delayed... the statement from the product manager was "it will ship when it's ready."

Given that 10.1 should have been the first release and Mac OS X wasn't network-stable until 10.2.3, I'm siding with Apple on this. Tiger is a fine release, and I'd rather continue to use it into October, than hope to see a 10.5.3 then to fix the bugs that a premature 10.5 in June would probably yield.

Eating humble pie due to delay is better than a black eye caused by kernal panics, and imperfect features.
- Marc

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Fletch wrote:
Apple really had a chance to show the buying public something new and fresh and diverted some marketshare in their direction.

Instead, they focused on a phone. Another blown opportunity.

Bearing in mind that, alas, Kurt Vonnegut died yesterday, all I can say is, "So it goes."

Fortunately OS X isn't dead. Or not at this point.

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Small White Car wrote:

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Fletch wrote:
Apple really had a chance to show the buying public something new and fresh and diverted some marketshare in their direction.

Instead, they focused on a phone. Another blown opportunity.

That's funny, I just convinced 3 different windows-using coworkers on getting a Macbook in the last 6 weeks.

They're all very happy with their choice.

Have you been showing people Tiger and heard them say "No thanks, I'll go with Vista"? How many did that? More than my 3?

June 20 or 21 is the last day of Spring. October is four months later. Accordingly, Apple is only four months behind, not six. Moreover, if Apple ships early October, it will be closer to three months. It also said it will put a beta into developers hands in June and that the OS is feature complete.

Some sites have been reporting for months that Leopard did not appear finished. Moreover, it made no sense that Apple would be releasing an OS without first showing it at Developer conference and giving developers time to play with it.

Apple's statement also makes sense. Apple has invested alot of time miniaturizing Leopard for other devices, such as the iPhone and Apple TV. You can also bet the next iPod will run OSX. Obviously it is OSX engineers that are going to be doing that.

Finally, Apple cannot win. When it keeps its mouth shut about product announcements people complain. When it gives you advanced notice people complain.

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mchampag wrote:

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Partsmutt wrote:
Apple has definitely fallen in my eyes. They don't give a crap about those of us who made them what they are today. Instead they're chasing some other market that by most predictions is a 50-50 shot at best.

Sadly, I must agree. Apple has tossed the notion of shipping on time out the door:

1. at Macworld, they announced 2 products that weren't ready (iPhone and Apple TV).

2. Apple TV ships after its promised date.

3. Leopard is now pushed back 6 months (wasn't it originally scheduled for a spring release?)

(Who knows what delays iPhone will face?)

And who was crowing the loudest when that-which-shall-not-be-named kept pushing back the release of their stupid wannabe OS? We were. And now Apple's setting us up for a meal of humble pie. Bah.

1. The team working on the iPhone is still working on OSX! It is the core of everything at Apple. And more important: The phone is going to lift the OS to the next level. Heard about the new and patented (Apple-) ideas for devices to replace the mouse?

2. Apparently Apple does not need the money. They will get more than expected from laptop-sales, from the (DRM-free) iTunes store - and now from the pro-machines. There are many folks all over the world in the creative business who will buy tomorrow an eight-core with the new CS suite. They can't wait until October.

So, what's wrong with that? The cash is rolling in.

This news is somewhat disappointing to me, but what bothers me more is the possibility that updates to iLife and iWork could be delayed as well.

...Steve used to regularly blow us away with "one more thing" at Macworld, which was ALWAYS available from Apple IMMEDIATELY after the keynote. So expecting "spring release" to mean March 21 is hardly unreasonable.

And why has Steve departed from his former rule of NEVER announcing before availability? The MacBook Pro and Intel-based iMacs were SURPRISE ANNOUNCEMENTS at Macworld 06, remember? Steve took pains to keep everyone's expectations modest, and then blew us all away with new products at least every couple of months.

So why the "delays" all of a sudden!?? Remember "Redmond, start your copiers!" Well, the copiers are probably warmed up and ready by now... when are they going to get an opportunity to use them?

Fletch was right on the money when he said "The iPod also has stagnated." Where's the widescreen iPod with 80Gb HD? Who cares about a video iPod with only 8Gb even IF your mom can call you on it to let you know the cat came home? Sheesh!

Give us a REAL video iPod, dangit! (Mr. Steve, sir.)

-Matt

P.S. Okay, Leopard's only pushed back FOUR months. Holy Toledo, you people are nitpickers.

Everybody has postulated for years that one of the primary reasons the Newton failed was that it was rushed to market not ready. Here, Apple is doing everything in its power to make sure that 1. The iPhone doesn't repeat this mistake, and 2. Leopard doesn't fall into the same trap...

And what's the result?

All this whining and baby-tantrums here on this board and countless others.

Sorry, guys, but no sympathies for the whining. I'll wait until 1. The iPhone has some time on the market, and 2. Leopard ships before I judge Apple for this decision.

-Jon

Megalosoft delayed Longho..., umm, I mean Vista a few years. Years! And it still isn't what it shoulda, coulda been. Apple delays Leopard a few months and now the company is evil. (overstated on purpose)

Folks need to get a grip.

I agree with several posters who point out that Apple's focus on the iPhone is a good thing and that the delay of Leopard in not such a bad thing.

Almost daily some one hints at, talks about, or actually releases an "iPhone killer" or iPhone wannabe. The competiton in the mobile market is tough, far tougher than the music player or computer market. If Apple does not hit the ground running with all engines on full burn it will not only affect its standings in the mobile arena, but in the other markets Apple is in already.

Apple has a reputation to maintain, its products can't just work, they have to work very well, be reliable, and excite users. Jobs and crew understand this and I have to believe that focusing on this new product is the result of that understanding.

Think about what would happen if the iPhone flopped and think how it would affect the iPod, OS X, and Macs. when you do it will become clearer that this delay is likely the right thing to do.

Just my opinion.

Vern Seward

+

Just in time, I'm sure that this slight delay in Leopard will lead to new and astoundingly ignorant Death Knells, which are always good for their entertainment value alone. It's been too long since we've had a really good addition to the ADKC, IMHO.

So when will the usual suspects (Enderle, Dvorak) weigh in on this latest Apple tragedy?

Yes, Steve would and probably will continue to blow us away. However, sometimes it makes more sense to pre-release. The iPhone was one of those times. Apple was being hammered everyday in the paper about how it was going to release a phone. If it did not give the media something, the stock would be sitting at $65 a share right now. Also, if Steve always surprises you at the end of a show, there gets to be a point were it is no longer a surprise because you expect the one more thing.

Moreover, in my view it is never reasonable to expect any prompt deliveries from Apple or any other company for that matter. I am more times then not disappointed.

I agree that the high end iPod has stagnated (but not the Nano and Shuffle). Apple is smart though. More people buy Nanos and Shuffles around the Holidays, so it completely revamped those products, but only gave the regular iPod a minor refresh. My thought on the iPod is that Apple is holding off on refreshing the iPod until after the iPhone is released. It is doing this to not detract from the excitement over the iPhone, and because the new Video iPod will use much of the same technology as the iPhone. When excitement wanes on the iPhone, Apple will release the new iPod.

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mchampag wrote:
...Steve used to regularly blow us away with "one more thing" at Macworld, which was ALWAYS available from Apple IMMEDIATELY after the keynote. So expecting "spring release" to mean March 21 is hardly unreasonable.

And why has Steve departed from his former rule of NEVER announcing before availability? The MacBook Pro and Intel-based iMacs were SURPRISE ANNOUNCEMENTS at Macworld 06, remember? Steve took pains to keep everyone's expectations modest, and then blew us all away with new products at least every couple of months.

So why the "delays" all of a sudden!?? Remember "Redmond, start your copiers!" Well, the copiers are probably warmed up and ready by now... when are they going to get an opportunity to use them?

Fletch was right on the money when he said "The iPod also has stagnated." Where's the widescreen iPod with 80Gb HD? Who cares about a video iPod with only 8Gb even IF your mom can call you on it to let you know the cat came home? Sheesh!

Give us a REAL video iPod, dangit! (Mr. Steve, sir.)

-Matt

P.S. Okay, Leopard's only pushed back FOUR months. Holy Toledo, you people are nitpickers.

First, if it was the only service available you wouldn't have to switch as you would either not have service, or you'd currently be with AT&T.

Second, stop being so selfish, I have used Macs for over fifteen years, am a loyal user, and I want Apple to release a phone. So when you say Apple does not give a crap about loyal users, that is silly. I as a loyal user have been clamoring for a Apple phone for years.

Third, why would anybody but possible a day trader be angry about this? Upset, yes. Disappointed, yes. Angry, that is absurd. It is only a fourth, possibly closer to three month delay. Reserve anger for something meaningful, like when somebody runs over your dog.

Fourth, if you really like Apple products, it would be a very bad thing if Apple lost its shirt over the iPhone. All of Apple's products would suffer. Besides wishing Apple ill will over something silly is pretty mean. Gandhi would not be impressed.


[quote="Partsmutt"I wouldn't switch cell service to AT&T if it was the only service available.. . .

Apple has definitely fallen in my eyes. They don't give a crap about those of us who made them what they are today. Instead they're chasing some other market that by most predictions is a 50-50 shot at best. I've never wished bad things on them, but I'm so angry about this that I will now. I hope they loose their shirt on this stupid phone.[/quote]

This reminds me of when Apple waited 10 months to update the Macbook Pro. The people who wanted MacBook Pro's suddenly started talking about how stupid Apple was being and how they were making a huge mistake. Translation: "I want it now! Don't make me wait! Waahhh!"

Same thing here. Unless you are like some software developer who's new software can't be released until Leopard, then what is the negative effect to you? Does 10.4 not work? Is it missing some super critical feature that is preventing you from using your computer? Maybe its just the super poor people who were hoping to wait until Leopard came out to buy a new Mac. Shelling out the extra cash later for Leopard... oh no!

The fact that people managed to work the long rumored touch screen ipod into this just further proves my point. Gimme now! Waahh!

Now I plan on getting an iPhone on day 1. So my analysis of this situation is certainly biased. But, naturally, I don't think I'm too far off. Life will go on. But on the plus side, this news might help AAPL get down to a point where Bosco is ready to buy.

just a company that makes computers. The best computers, and the best OS out there, to be sure. But The Steve wants Apple, Inc. positioned as a consumer electronics company, not a computer company.

Two things are true:

The Steve makes a lot of decisions that tick people off, including loyal users (my first Mac was an SE).

And, when The Steve is in charge, great things happen.

And it isn't a six month delay; more like four. And, we're being told why. I question their priorities, but not their reasoning.

I am sad that 10.5 is delayed. But I can wait.

I've been waiting for a decently priced Mac for some time. the Last Mac I bought was a MDD Dual G4 ($1500 in 2003). It still runs strong. But I can't afford those new Mac Pro Towers, and the iMac and Mac mini are too limiting to me (expansion etc) so I sit and wait to see what Apple brings out next.

I was interested in apple TV for a bit, because I thought it was something similar to a DVR.

My new Video iPod 80GB my wife got me for my B-day is my new toy to play with.