Hello, iPhone & Don’t Play with the Dead

| MacOS KenDensed

Mac OS Ken's Ken RayIt was another busy week for Apple. iPhone 4S pre-sales were through the roof, and customers were ready to hand over their hard-earned cash on Friday if they hadn’t preordered. The release of iOS 5 practically brought the Internet to its knees, and Google and Samsung had a hard time coping with Apple’s dominance in the news and in the smartphone market. As if that isn’t enough, this week Mac OS Ken’s Ken Ray gets on his soap box, too, over Google and Samsung’s media tactics.

iPhone 4S: Who’s Crying Now?
Who’s disappointed that the next iPhone is an evolutionary 4S rather than a revolutionary 5? Indications seem to be no one.

Apple issued a press release Monday — which I sure thought was some sort of holiday in the states — saying that iPhone 4S pre-orders had topped one million in the first 24 hours of availability. The company says that beats the previous single day pre-order record of 600-thousand attained by its predecessor, iPhone 4.

Apple Senior VP of Worldwide Product Marketing Phil Schiller says the company is “blown away with the incredible customer response to iPhone 4S… The first day pre-orders for iPhone 4S have been the most for any new product that Apple has ever launched and we are thrilled that customers love iPhone 4S as much as we do.”

While it’s too early to say who the big winner was, is, or will be, among iPhone 4S carriers in the states, the Death Star sems to be as powerful as ever. AllThingsD has AT&T announcing late Friday that it had processed a record 200-thousand pre-orders in the the first 12 hours of availability, making the 4S launch the most successful iPhone launch the company has ever seen.

Not giving hard numbers of its own, new comer Sprint, which welcomes the 4S at the first iPhone available on its network. No hard numbers, but satisfaction.

Sprint VP of Product Development Fared Adib issued a statement, saying, “We are very, very pleased with the initial first day of iPhone 4S preorders. Today’s sales and the overall customer experience greatly exceeded our expectations.”

Exceeding expectations has to be the best news imaginable for Sprint since it seems they are in fact betting the store on Apple’s communicator. Electronista has Sprint execs speaking at its Strategy Update event in New York City naming the iPhone the bright center of its universe.

You might well picture Sprint CEO Dan Hesse with kaiser rolls on his head and a flowing white robe saying, “Help me iPhone 4S… you’re my only hope.”

Think I’m overstating it?

Quoting the CEO, “How do we take both [brand and churn] to the next level? The answer is the iPhone. You want to be associated with great brands, and Apple is the best brand in the tech space.”

That comparison kind of has to stop right there though, otherwise in a week or two we’d find out that AT&T CEO Randal Stephenson was Dan Hesse’s father… and someone at Verizon would have to have their hand cut off.

Google & Samsung: Time Out!
Google and Samsung are holding off on an event that had been scheduled for this week due to the passing of Apple cofounder Steve Jobs. Is this out of respect? Mmmm…

Here’s what we know: The two companies had been scheduled to announce the first phone based on the next version of Android, Ice Cream Sandwich. That was supposed to go off at the CTIA wireless industry trade show in San Diego.

Last Friday they said they’d changed their minds though, saying in a statement to AllThingsD, “We believe this is not the right time to announce a new product as the world expresses tribute to Steve Jobs’s passing.”

On it’s own Samsung had also said, “Under the current circumstances, both parties have agreed that this is not the appropriate time for the announcement of a new product.”

It would be neat to assume that this was out of respect for Jobs, but — seriously — two Tuesdays was the iPhone 4S announcement, the following Wednesday was when Jobs passed, that Friday iPhone 4S pre-orders started, and this week came iOS 5 and iPhone 4S sales in brick-and-mortar stores. Under all of those circumstances, none of which Google and Samsung could have known about when the CTIA event was planned, a product announcement would just be stupid.

Sorry to be cynical… but it’s easy to think that they used last Wednesday as a way to gracefully get out of today and the attack of the iThings.

May I now add a bit of support to the “did it for the press, not out of respect” argument? AppleInsider has Google filing a friend-of-the-court brief along side wireless carrier T-Mobile USA against Apple.

Where be your respect now?

According to the piece, the two have filed with the US International Trade Commission asking the body to not ban HTC’s Android products, with T-Mobile saying it would like to see that even if the HTC phones infringe Apple’s intellectual property.

I’m sorry, what?

IP expert Florian Mueller added the T-Mobile brief “asks the ITC to deny an import ban even if an infringement is found…” though — if they feel they must — could T-Mobile have between four and six months to sell the devices first?

Chutzpah!

As the argument goes, “With such a transition period, ‘T-Mobile and the rest of the industry could change to other devices without harming U.S. consumers.’”

For its part, Google doesn’t even look at the HTC infringing bit, arguing instead that a ban would “eliminate the competition from a fast-moving, maverick competitor (HTC),” a shift that it argues “could drive up prices, diminish service, decrease consumers’ access to the technology, and reduce innovation.”

The list of plagues that would be visited upon us would be almost biblical with Google saying that a preliminary injunction against the four HTC phones that Apple says infringe its IP would

…likely raise the price of mobile devices to U.S. consumers, diminish the variety of devices available, lower the number of consumers that have access to the critical public health and welfare benefits of mobile computing, reduce innovation in the mobile device industry, reduce the development of critical wireless network infrastructure, lower the number of mobile applications created, raise barriers to entry, and threaten the only open mobile computing platform.

And if that doesn’t scare ya, the NEXT paragraph mentions locusts, pestilence, and Ragnarok.

Still, it’s hard to imagine Apple would mind… I mean… Google’s been so respectful…

New Kid on the Block
The big star early in the week, though, was iOS 5, said by some reviewers to be significant enough to make compatible machines such as the iPhone 4, the iPhone 3GS, both available iPads and the third and fourth generations of the iPod touch feel like new machines.

Of the 200 or so new features, Apple highlights Notification Center, which is neat, iMessage, which is neat, Newsstand, which is confusing… my Newsstand has stuff on it that to which I’ve never subscribed, while at least one magazine to which I have subscribed… not on my Newsstand. I ask you… without actually asking you.

Reminders, deep Twitter integration, letting users tweet directly from Safari, Photos, Camera, YouTube, or Maps, a way to access the Camera while the screen is locked — which is awesome, built-in photo editing, tabbed browsing in Safari — which is awesome, it does the whole computer cord cutting thing, Wi-Fi Syncing, Multitasking Gestures for iPad, AirPlay Mirroring for iPad 2, and a slew of new accessibility features for people with mobility, hearing, vision, and cognitive disabilities.

It took me hours mid-day on release day to update my iPad 2, though middle of the night updating my iPhone 4 took about an hour. Maybe a little more. I had one guy tell me that he ended up with a bricked iPhone, though — if memory serves — that was fixed later in the day.

The reasons for the troubles were unclear, though swamped servers on Apple’s end could be the cause. I mean, imagine how many millions of people were trying to update iThings on release day, and a lot of those with more than one device.

One caller to Mac OS Ken: Live suggested to family members that they wait to upgrade until next week, though I am nowhere near that kind of patient when it comes to iThing updates.

Best of luck to you.

Samsung’s Kick in the Pants
Mark it another crappy week for Samsung. The New York Times says an Australian court has put the whammy on Sammy, imposing a temporary ban on the Galaxy Tab 10.1.

And now they’re in a world of hurt, Bert… they’re in a jam, Pam… they may wanna slip out the back, Jack… make a new plan, Stan… there’s no need to recite the rest of that tune… June.

Apple wins again with the Australian court barring sales of the Samsung tablet at east until the court rules on Apple’s claims of patent violation, which could easily push past the holiday shopping season. And that would be huge in a bad way for the Korean company. According to the paper of record, “Samsung has said that the product’s viability in the Australian market would be killed off if it missed Christmas.”

They need stop-motion holiday characters to come to their rescue.

Meanwhile, the company has a different plan for working around other bans in the Netherlands. Electronista has Sammy saying, “Hey babe… we’ll release upgraded versions of things.”

According to the piece, Samsung will tweak the Galaxy S, Galaxy S II, and Galaxy Ace to move on past sales bans imposed in the Netherlands. Company official James Chung says Samsung has “fixed the technological problem” with its implementation of photo browsing that got the devices booted in the first place.

No word on when the revved machines might go on sale.

Don’t Play with the Dead
And finally this week, an editorial of sorts.

I’ve seen a few pieces over the past week that have said Google and Samsung postponed their Ice Cream Sandwich phone event out of respect for the passing of Apple co-founder Steve Jobs.

I would like to issue one blanket correction for all of those: In the pieces I’ve read, neither Samsung nor Google said anything about postponing the event out of respect. Executives from both Samsung and Google did issue statements of condolence and respect when Jobs passed away, but what they said about the Ice Cream Sandwich event was, basically, now’s not the time.

The exact quotes from Samsung, according to a piece from AllThingsD,

Samsung and Google have decided to postpone the Samsung Mobile Unpacked event during the CTIA in San Diego, previously scheduled for October 11. Under the current circumstances, both parties have agreed that this is not the appropriate time for the announcement of a new product.

Later in the day Samsung went on to issue what sounded like a clarification, but it wasn’t. “We believe this is not the right time to announce a new product as the world expresses tribute to Steve Jobs’s passing,” they said.

Actually, they were expressing tribute to Jobs, not his passing. But even leaving that off, it was, according to Samsung’s statement, the world expressing tribute to Steve Jobs’s passing, not Samsung and Google.

Why does this bother me so much?

Because you don’t play with the dead. Not for political gain. Not for PR. You don’t play with the dead.

Look, Samsung and Google were in a pickle. They had a new phone and operating system event scheduled for October 11th. They probably had that scheduled for weeks if not months. Then Apple comes out and says, “Let’s talk iPhone.” Then Apple says new mobile operating system on October 12th and whole new phones on October 14th. Get your breathing apparatus. All of the air is about to be sucked out of the room by Apple and nobody’s going to pay attention to your new phone and operating system except for the people in the hall in which you’re speaking.

No way Google and Samsung are able to back out of the event, so they’re just gonna have to soldier on. Until Wednesday, October 5th when the guiding force behind Apple and the iPhone (which went a long way to making Android and the various smartphones that use it more than a pipe dream) dies.

The world is stunned. The tech world is stunned. And Google and Samsung see a way out.

Being human, our immediate reaction is to equate the “Ice Cream Sandwich” postponement with respect.

But in the same week, Google filed a friend of the court brief against Apple’s move to block the sale of some HTC phone. Should Google file such a brief? Absolutely. But if it’s disrespectful to launch your own phone the week that Jobs passes away, is it not also disrespectful to argue against the company he cofounded?

Samsung, this week, started a cute promotional stunt in Australia. The Sydney Morning Herald says the Korean electronics company “has ambushed the launch of the iPhone 4S by offering $2 smartphones in a temporary shop just metres away from the official Sydney Apple store.”

That started the promotion on Monday, October 10th, the day before Google and Samsung would have you believe they decided it would be disrespectful to launch a new phone and operating system.

While it is meant to be an internal affair, word has leaked out that Apple CEO Tim Cook has set aside this coming Wednesday, October 19th, as a day for Apple employees to celebrate the life of the company’s fallen co-founder. For people who follow tech news this is common knowledge.

In other news, Google and Samsung have set a new date for the recently postponed “Ice Cream Sandwich” event. You’ll never guess which day they’ve picked.

From another AllThingsD piece: “The event, which is expected to see the debut of the next version of Android as well as the first device running the operating system, will now take place on October 19 in Hong Kong.”

To be clear, I have no problem with companies doing business. I have no problem with companies competing. I have no problem with promotional stunts and the occasional war of words in the press. I have no problem with companies postponing an event if holding that event will be a waste of their time and resources. I kind of wish that happened more often.

But don’t play with the dead. Say the real reason you’re canceling or don’t give a reason at all. But if it’s not out of respect, don’t imply that it is. To do so makes “business as usual” look disrespectful. And feigning respect is reprehensible.

Comments

It's a good thing to have experts

Unfortunately experts have an area of expertise—that part of their knowledge in which they know of which they speak.

You think you’re an Apple IOS expert.  You speak confidently about IOS 5, so I assume you have spent all two days becoming an expert at it.

Unfortunately, you’re not an Android expert.  You’re not an Android Market expert.  You’re not an Android Handset expert.  In short, your ramblings with respect to Android, Droid, ecosystems… well.. fanciful dreams in print.

It’s ok.  I see that you write your rants on “macobserver” and not on “familiary-with-android” or “even-have-a-clue-about-anything-other-than-apple-products.”  I don’t expect more.  Neither do your readers, I’m sure.

Shape up.  Or shut up.

E

David Juliano

Unfortunately I read your “article” and am not a much dumber person for having done so.  Android clearly blows away iOS5 which is why apple copied all 200 “new features” directly from android.  Ice Cream will be out next week along with 12mp cam phones and quad core cpu early next year.  Apple is once again old news and behind the times.  Have you figured out yet why iphone marketshare has dropped from 28 to 27% whild android marketshare has grown to between 40 and 51%?  Simple actually.  All the lemmings aka sheeple have bought iphone’s already.  4S comes out, the sheeple scream, get in line, trade in their old iphones for the 4s.  A percentage of sheeple are tired of being left behind and upgrade to android thus the 1% marketshare slip of iOS.  Expect Android to hit 65% marketshare by summer while iOS still slips.

Dave123456

Hong Kong is of course 12 hours ahead of us, so it’s really the day before whatever event Apple’s having.

Quad core CPUs? Is that the magical fairy dust that will make Android no longer be crap? Guess what cupcake- iPhones can now be had for free also. On the big 3 networks.

Android’s free ride is officially over.

cambo

Utter crap. Stop trying to justify Apple’s shortcomings. Releasing mostly old tech and marketing it as state of the art is not good for anyone. The “Blah, blah, blah it doesn’t affect you, so why do you care” statement is crap. It DOES affect me because the money that could be going towards actual innovation is being spent on the past. It just goes to show how ignorant to things people really are. Same with politics.. it’s the same every year - a bunch of guys make a bunch of promises that they know they can’t keep and people are all “YEAHHHH I KNOW STUFF SO I’M VOTING FOR THIS GUY!!!!”. Wake up people

IPhones for free, and so's your whiskey

iPhones can now be had for free also

Yes, obsolete hardware is often offered for free in return for a service plan.

As with most things, you get what you pay for.  iPhone for free is worth zero.

Quad core CPUs? Is that the magical fairy dust that will make Android no longer be crap?

No, lol.  Android isn’t crap, and that’s why it is almost two thirds of the market.  IOS isn’t crap either, but Apple’s tactics are, and their closed-source closed-market, and patent lawsuits will be the death of them.

I’m not worried.  I saw Apple die once before.  Then they came back.  I look forward to the new death.  Perhaps this time they will learn.  Either way they won’t have Steve Jobs to messiah their ass out of the morass they created.

E

adamC

I don’t know why droid fanbois always say the same thing like blown away and for once I would like too see droid products have an UI that is different from an IPhone.

When that day comes then they have blown away the iPhone otherwise please shut up and admit droid products are just copycats of he iPhone.

If you are happy with copycats who am I to admit you are wrong but just shut up and get a life.

Uncle Bob

sympathy sales

furbies

Can we please have a moment of sanity civility ?

If your preferred device is is Android, then great! Enjoy! Be Happy!

If your preferred device is is iOS, then great! Enjoy! Be Happy!

There’s really no need for the Android folk to come here and be rude, insulting or obnoxious. This is a website aimed at those who prefer all thing Apple. (Even though we may from time to time, question decisions emanating from Apple.)

Surely there are websites that cater to the Android market, and point of view ? And surely you’d find a better welcome there ?

apple lover

droid products are just copycats of he iPhone.

Actually, iOS5 is just a copy of Android.  All 200 “new features” of iOS5 were in android for years.

furbies

All 200 ?new features? of iOS5 were in android for years.

I’m sorry, but “Years” ?

Android on Wikipedia V1.0 was “Released 23 September 2008.”

That’s barely 3 years ago.

The iPhone was released on June 29, 2007.

So, which came first ? The iPhone or Android ? Hmmm

Besides, who cares ?
You like Android ? Great! Be happy!
You like iPhone/iOS ? Great! Be happy!

Aren’t there more important things to worry about in the world ?

pgood

Pretty interesting, though deeply biased article; I found the connection you made between Google’s sympathy for Jobs’ passing a bit too opinionated and strictly devoid of reason.

I understand you’re an apple-guy and all, but do realize that a major company isn’t going to gobble up their competitor’s dick on all fronts because a CEO passed away. A show of respect doesn’t always have a hidden goal, and major companies in a capitalist world don’t exactly need to bend over backwards. This was probably an argument that the two companies have had before Jobs died, but guess what? Jobs didn’t take Apple to the grave with him (yet anyway).

No, it’s not disrespectful to argue against the company Steve Jobs co-founded. I’m surprised Apple’s competitors even chose to push back the release dates.

Personally, I think Apple has less respect for the dead by capitalizing on the sales opportunity like they did.

Nemo

I suppose that it is a sign of TMO’s growing popularity and influence that the forces of the Android empire have started directing its trolls to populate TMO’s comments and forums with nonsense, such as the iPhone and/or the iOS being copies of Android, when it is the iPhone that preceded Android as a smartphone by at least 18 months and when it is Android and/or Android OEMs that are losing battles in court after court for infringing on Apple’s intellectual property (IP); when nearly all Android OEMs have had to pay Microsoft royalties for infringing on Microsoft’s technology in their respective Android devices; where in the Oracle v. Google lawsuit over Google’s alleged infringement of Oracles’ Java patents in Android, things are going very badly for Google, and where a Dutch court just gave a resounding rebuke to Samsung for trying to obtain an injunction against Apple based on FRAND patents that Samsung has an obligation to license to Apple and all other on fair, reasonable, and non-discriminatory (FRAND) terms.

Still, I have a critique of Google and its Android OEMs:  why did it take them 18 months to copy Apple’s innovative iPhone, when Eric Schmidt, then Google’s CEO, was sitting on Apple’s Board, eating Apple’s bread, drinking its wine, and receiving for free all of the latest Apple gear, while, for a time as an Apple Board member, he was privy to Apple’s latest secret plans for its iOS devices.  If you ask me Google and its OEMs were rather lazy, as given the forgoing, it shouldn’t have taken them more than 6 months to copy Apple’s innovation in the iPhone, and surely it doesn’t taken 18 months to simply use Java in Android without Oracle’s permission and for Android OEMs to use Microsoft’s IP in their Android devices without Microsoft’s permission.  But I suppose that haste makes waste, and, thus, Google and its Android OEMs wanted to be certain that they offered nothing less than a faithful rendition of Apple, Microsoft, and Oracle’s technologies.

Really, when you think about it, Google and/or its Android OEMs should have been able to do far better than the paltry handful of minor innovations, noted by some trolls, supra, in Android and Android devices that they have achieved, given that they relieved themselves of having to innovate in the revolutionary, fundamental stuff in the iPhone by “borrowing” Apple, Oracle, and Microsoft’s IP.  But I suppose that all of the Android copying of others’ fundamental technologies is simply another sign of Google and its Android OEM’s respect, for isn’t imitation the sincerest form of flattery?

And Ken, of course Google and Samsung are showing Steve Jobs respect by delaying the Ice Cream Sandwich, and I have no doubt that Eric Schmidt is speaking the truth, as he appears on every talk show that will have him—while all of Steve’s true friends have remained pretty much silent on their personal dealings with him—to proclaim what great buddies he and Jobs were, after Google stabbed Jobs and Apple in the back with Android by planning Android while Eric was sitting on Apple’s Board—because we all know what a forgiving and turn-the-other-cheek sort of guy Steve was, especially when it came to treachery against Apple.  For as we all know:  the anonymous man passes away in anonymity, while the passing of a great man, like Jobs, is attended by a million sycophants.

ronrodex

Oh my God, so much hate so little reasons. Speak tons about auditory iPhone serves.

The fact is both platforms are great. Android is a more progressive and more of prototype thus intended for people with time and not afraid of tech. Android shapes the future. Believe it or not, the fact is that Apple didn’t innovate much with iPhone 4s and ios5; nor in hardware nor in software.200 New features are not that new, Siri is not new, android gotten voice action long time ago, notification center in android existed for years, and many more, but not all. But I would gladly buy iPhone for my less tech savvy friends and relatives. It is wory free advanced tech.

However, I wouldn’t patronize Apple much due to predatory business tactics. Their products are just to simple and restive for me anyway.

Lee Dronick

I?m sorry, but ?Years? ?

Android on Wikipedia V1.0 was ?Released 23 September 2008.?

That?s barely 3 years ago.

It is quite possible that iOS 5 was conceived on a lab table years ago, but had a long gestation period. Whatever the case may be, I am not going to give up my obviously superior iPhone because some Android had a feature first.

mrmwebmax

+

Wow. Ken, very good article. Android trolls, what gives? First of all, if you’re going to come to TMO and rant and rave like lunatics, have the courage to sign up for a user account, rather than just post anonymously. And pgood, how did Apple capitalize on Steve Jobs’ death, as you claim? By taking down all of their Home page product advertisements, and posting a picture of Jobs in his memory instead? (Apple has a long track record of using its Home page in such a way. Remember 911, for example.) By asking people to buy an iPhone 4S in his honor? How about backing up your lunatic comments with some actual facts, huh?

Lunatics

Dear mrmgraphics (your real name, I’m sure)

You did use the word “lunatics” twice.  I guess that makes it true, and doesn’t require you to address ANY of the comments ANYONE said before you.

Not only that you didn’t address ANY of the comments, you didn’t address ANYTHING related to the article.

It’s cute that we’re all lunatics.  You, ma’am are offtopic.  To borrow your own advice, despite your lunacy, have the courage to sign your name.

Ehud

mrmwebmax

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You did use the word ?lunatics? twice.? I guess that makes it true, and doesn?t require you to address ANY of the comments ANYONE said before you.

I suggest that you re-read my post. Slowly. If you do so, then you will see that I plainly DID ADDRESS a specific comment that came before mine; namely, pgood’s claim that Apple somehow capitalized on Steve Jobs’ death. That refutes your claim that I failed to address any comments that came before mine.

As for Fandroids posting anonymously, I merely said “...have the courage to sign up for a user account,” not sign off with your actual name, rank, and serial number. No, mrmgraphics is not my real name. It is my screen name here and elsewhere. I’m signed into my account, and if you mouse over my screen name, you’ll see that I’ve been a member here since 2003. Members here are known by their screen names. I’m the only one who posts using “mrmgraphics,” and I don’t post under a dozen different non-user-account names, as is quite possibly done by the Fandroid community here. You, Lunatics, could also be pgood, or Uncle Bob for all we know, and until you and others like you sign up for an account and get a screen name, we’ll never know.

gavron

I’m sure reading slowly aids your comprehension, and I appreciate your sharing that with me.  I’ve registered for an account so as to confuse you less.  I always sign what I write… so whether you agree with me or not, at least know I stand behind my words and this is not a drive-by fanboi spew.

I am not pgood nor did I claim Apple capitalized on Steve Jobs’ death.  He was a good man and I’m sorry he is no longer with us. 

I am Ehud Gavron.  I sign all my posts.  Sometimes abbreviated as “-E” but always signed.

Regards,

Ehud

OldMorris

Ehud, what you lack in diplomacy you make up in assertion and strong words. If its said loudly enough and forcefully enough and offensively enough then perhaps your opinion will appear strong and factual. In essence your first post was actually without connection in logical progression. Your conclusion stands alone by itself without connection to the rest of the post. There really is no substance to your opinion that the expert is for some reason not an expert on something he never claimed to be expert on. I think the interpretation of events presented in the commentary by the writer can be weighed by the reader and judged against the events as they took place. The inconsistencies of companies and their spin is nothing new. Its hard to control a corporate message especially so when two companies are involved. I find it quite likely that Samsung and Google did not want their announcement overshadowed as the writer surmises. It may or may not be so. Neither you or I really know that, yet it is a reasonable assumption and actually plausible and probable. The author of the article has done a good job presenting his opinion. You? not so much… Meh

furbies

Sir Harry. I think you misunderstand me.

I was pointing out in response to a Android lover’s claims that Android had been around for years:

I?m sorry, but ?Years? ?

Android on Wikipedia V1.0 was ?Released 23 September 2008.?

That?s barely 3 years ago.

The iPhone was released on June 29, 2007.

gavron

Android on Wikipedia V1.0 was ?Released 23 September 2008.?

That?s barely 3 years ago.

I apologize that subtraction is not your fort?.  It’s not

barely 3 years

but a bit more than 3 years.  Clue:  October 16 2011 is more than 3 years after September 23 2008.

The iPhone was released on June 29, 2007.

I’m sure that’s important to you.  However, nobody in this thread asked… and nobody cares.  I do appreciate the free trivia.  13’6” is the maximum legal height of a vehicle in North Carolina.  I hope that helps you too.

Ehud

David Juliano

Android on Wikipedia V1.0 was ?Released 23 September 2008.?

That?s barely 3 years ago.

The iPhone was released on June 29, 2007

Interesting.  So what you are saying is that the iphone was around for 4 years and android around 3 years but it took until iOS5 to almost get the same feature set as android that has been available for years.  Thanks for the info.  One more reason to go with android..latest updates and ahead of iOS since android inception.

Lee Dronick

Sir Harry. I think you misunderstand me.

I was pointing out in response to a Android lover?s claims that Android had been around for years:

Sorry mate, that is what comes from living up over.

I was saying that Apple plans ahead, way ahead, they are probably working stuff we may not see until iPad4.

PS: Start calling me Lee. I am in a period of transition and am soon going to be using my real name.

mrmwebmax

+

barely 3 years

but a bit more than 3 years.? Clue:? October 16 2011 is more than 3 years after September 23 2008.

The next time a new Android phone has you tempted, might I suggest buying a dictionary instead? You see, “barely” does NOT mean “less than,” as you imply. It means, as dictionary.com explains:

only just; scarcely; no more than; almost not: He had barely enough money to pay for the car.

And Android has barely been around for three years, as in, just scarcely around for three years. And as for nobody in this thread either asking nor caring for when the original iPhone was released: Speak for yourself. You do not speak for me, nor anyone else here. This is an Apple enthusiast website, so I can only guess that a fair number of us here are interested in what came first: iPhone or Android, given the nature of this discussion.

Thanks for letting me know that the maximum legal height of vehicles in North Carolina is 13’6”. Free trivia for you: Today is National Feral Cat Day. FYI.

Sincerely yours,
Michael R McKinney (aka mrmgraphics, although any geek worth his or her salt could have figured that out—duh, my screen name is a domain name, ever hear of WHOIS?)
website, graphic design, and SEO consultant
member TMO since 2003
member Alley Cat Allies and a proud rescuer of feral cats on the side
so there

gavron

Nobody cares when IOS was released.  Really, just saying it again is not making a point.  Like I said, nobody asked, nobody cared. 

duh, my screen name is a domain name, ever hear of WHOIS?)

Yes, I have heard of these things…  A screen name is a nonsense term created by AOL in 1991 just about the time they came up with the bad grammar phrase “You’ve got mail.”  Point of trivia - AOL was not on the Internet at that time.  They were hoping to be the next big “portal” like Compuserver, Bix, and others.  How’s that “screen name” working for your “room”?

Domain names are very well known.  “mrmgraphics” is not one.  Domain names have multiple components separated by periods.  “mrmgraphics” is not anything. 

Finally WHOIS is an application. The protocol is NICNAME.  It’s covered by http://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc812.  I’m familiar with both, and thanks for asking.

14’0”.  That’s the maximum height of a vehicle in New Mexico.  See, I’ve taught you many things today.  In addition you now know how stupid it is to say “screen name” or “HELLO ROOM” in this century.

Ehud

sflocal

Sad little Android Fantards.  They now come to infest TMO’s boards spewing the same, tired nonsense.

You like Android?  Fine.  Go away to your own crevices and enjoy.  The rest of the world is tired of hearing the same rants from you jerks.

Meanwhile, we will continue enjoying the best selling phone with the most polished OS.  You know, the product that has proven you whiny little brats wrong since the beginning. 

Go piss in your own pool, and stay out of ours.

mrmwebmax

+

A screen name is a nonsense term created by AOL in 1991 just about the time they came up with the bad grammar phrase ?You?ve got mail.?? Point of trivia - AOL was not on the Internet at that time.? They were hoping to be the next big ?portal? like Compuserver, Bix, and others.? How?s that ?screen name? working for your ?room??

I’m almost laughing too hard to type this. Compuserver? You say that as someone passing yourself off as knowing what the f*** you’re saying? Duh…it was “CompuServe.” No “r” at the end, capital “S” in the middle. HQ in Columbus, Ohio. I know because I WORKED THERE in the early 1990s. Search my posts here on TMO, you’ll find plenty of references, including a recent post taking about how companies, like RIM, are making the same fatal mistake that CompuServe did: Relying on previously successful business models while the world changed around them.

As for domain names…they’re separated by periods? Are you kidding me??!! WOW! Learned something new today…other than always knowing that any worthwhile domain name ended in .com, as does mrmgraphics. As in mrmgraphics.com. You could have just clicked on my mrmgraphics name on any post an be directed to my perpetually-under-construction website (I first build those who pay me real money, hence my own site’s neglect, because—damn!—people keep paying me real money to build their websites!).

As for stupid to say screen name? Are you freaking kidding me? This is not the AOL from the 1990s. This is the Internet of today. People have screen names. They did back in the day when CompuServe ruled the show, too, although they were octal numbers at the time. Again, I worked there, and actually know how to spell “CompuServe.” And yes, I know that CompuServe was NOT part of the Internet, nor was AOL: They had their own networks.

Is there a better term for “screen name”? Maybe. But it is what it is: an online name linked to your on-screen profile. Your screen name here is gavron. Mine is mrmgraphics. TMO resident legal expert is Nemo. These are screen names, call them what you wish.

gavron

You’re right.  I made a typographical error.  It was compuserve.  One of its data centers was right here in Tucson.

Still, I appreciate your hospitality. 

I hope your screen name and stuff work well for you.  Domain names are period-separated.  I didn’t say “ends in dot com”.  Best regards.

Screen names are nonsense words.

E

mrmwebmax

+

You?re right.? I made a typographical error.? It was compuserve.?

Caps key stuck? It was not “compuserve”. It was “CompuServe”. Wow…thought I made that clear in my last post. An ee cummings fan, perhaps?

As for domain names, yes, I know that they’re separated by periods. I personally own over twently, so this is not exactly news to me. That said, a .com will always seem more professional than, say a dot-anything-else.

Finally, just out of curiosity, what do you have against screen names? Seriously. Mine here is mrmgraphics, as it is on a number of other sites (including site based on cat care). Furthermore, I just received an email from a fellow TMO member regarding feral cat care, which could have only occurred because of this thread. So is that whole screen name thing working out well for me? If I can help a fellow TMO member help feral cats, it is working out as well as I can hope. Time will tell. But at least I got the email, and responded with advice based on my experience with feral cats.

Macdaddy

I love anything apple (been using apple products for 10 years) but looks like apple is slipping.  My new iphone4s is just not as nice as the Galaxy S2.  Even with iphone4 released on Verizon and around the world, iphone marketshare is stagnant at 27% while android now skyrocketing to 44% and expected to hit 50% by christmas with apple still at 27%.  I think I might have to finally upgrade to an android.  Anyone know when the quadcore 4.6” 12mp 2gig ram android phones are coming out?  I heard by christmas.  That makes my iphone4s look like a kids toy.

Facts:
Oct 5th, 2011:
http://searchengineland.com/comscore-android-nears-50-us-smartphone-market-share-95768

I can’t ignore the facts that my beloved apple is dying..

mrmwebmax

+

I can?t ignore the facts that my beloved apple is dying..

Umnn…you do know that Apple sold over 1 million of those pathetic 4S handsets on the first day of pre-order,right? And that Apple pretty much has over TWO-THIRDS of ALL profits in mobile phones, NOT JUST SMART PHONES:

How Apple is Sucking the Profit Out of the Mobile Phone Market

Oh dear, yes, poor Apple is doomed, and obviously slipping so badly…because those piles of cash under their feet can get pretty slippery over time….

furbies

What is the preoccupation with raw hardware specs ?

What should be important is:

a) ease of use
b) integration between devices
c) lack of viruses (or is that virii ?)
d) personal contentment with purchasing decision(s)

Of course, as a Apple product user, I would point out that based on profit/margin, Apple is winning hands down, and that sheer numbers don’t always equate with better.

Edit:

PS:
Don’t forget that to get the latest Android OS feature(s), you have to have an Android phone that is upgradable to the new OS, and it also relies on the responsible telecom company allowing the upgrade.

And most telecom companies hate allowing OS updates. It stops them from selling you a new phone with the wizz bang feature(s) you wanted to get.

This is something that Apple was able to stop the phone companies from preventing. Apple releases an update ? Then apart from older hardware that doesn’t support it, the update is available to all for free. (excluding ISP costs, which are out of Apple’s control)

macdaddy

Umnn?you do know that Apple sold over 1 million of those pathetic 4S handsets on the first day of pre-order,right?

Do you read before you post?  I said I bought a 4s also but then i tried the galaxy s2 and it seriously blows away the iphone.  Then with the quad core’s, bigger screen, faster, higher res camera, higher res screen, hdmi, on droid’s coming christmas, I might just have to upgrade.

bigMacFan

Ouch, just saw the new droid razr, one more nail in apple coffin.  Its thinner, bigger screen, way faster, better camera.  Announced Oct 18th.  My 4s is only a few days old and already its outdated.  Jeesh..

gavron

Ouch, just saw the new droid razr, one more nail in apple coffin.? Its thinner, bigger screen, way faster, better camera.? Announced Oct 18th.? My 4s is only a few days old and already its outdated.? Jeesh..

Forgot to add a link for “evidence”:
http://www.operationandroid.com/content/motorola-droid-razr-thiner-and-faster-iphone-4s/3136659
Droid Razr faster and thinner than iphone 4s

mrmwebmax

+

Do you read before you post??

Yes. Do you? I responded to the last sentence of your post, that your “beloved Apple is dying,” with an appropriate link to an article (one of many) showing that Apple has the lion’s share of mobile phone profit. This was to refute your completely ridiculous, Fandroid, unsupported claim that “Apple is dying.” With a million 4S pre-orders, customers lined up for blocks for the 4S, and a cash horde bigger than that of the United States government, I can only imagine that most companies can only wish they were “dying” as is Apple.

Get a clue.

mrmwebmax

+

Forgot to add a link for ?evidence?:
http://www.operationandroid.com/content/motorola-droid-razr-thiner-and-faster-iphone-4s/3136659
Droid Razr faster and thinner than iphone 4s

Hmnn…you say you “forgot” to add a link for evidence. That would imply that you didn’t add the link in YOUR original post. Yet that post was posted under the name “BigMacFan,” not “gavron.” And this post was under a non-logged-in gavron at that. So who are you, really? And how many Fandroids here are really you, whoever you are?

Having said all of that, the Motorola Razr is not supposed to be announced until October 18. The article you link to even states in its headline, “Motorola Droid RAZR Thiner and Faster Than the iPhone 4S?” Note question mark. FYI, that means we don’t know yet. Get a clue, or a copy of Strunk and White, to learn all about the fascinating world of punctuation and grammar. Then either sign in as yourself, or quit pretending to be someone who just signed up for a TMO account.

Lee Dronick

And how many Fandroids here are really you, whoever you are?

Having watched these situations over the years I have suspected that there is usually just one antagonist, maybe two or three, but usually just one. The writing styles of the various posters are very similar, they have common keywords and specious statements.

Whatever, the comments are probably not going to change anyone’s mind; I am not going to dump my as yet received iPhone 4s because an upcoming Android device has certain feature. I choose objects, tools, autos, and such in large part because they fit my personality. Not always of course and sometimes you just can’t help being a square peg. I have messed with around with my friends’ non-Apple smart phones. No thanks, but my pals like them so live an let live.

There is one thing about our recent guests, or guest if the case may be, and that is I appreciate the white space in your posts. Too often someone gets on a rant and their comments have no paragraph breaks and other poor formatting. I often don’t bother reading something if it doesn’t look good.

I am off to walk the beagles and then come back and have a second cup of French roast. You all have a great day.

RonMacGuy

To quote mhikl, please don’t feed the trolls. Just ignore them and they will go away.

Quad cores in a phone. LMAO. I can’t wait to see the battery specs on this thing. It is funny how comparisons are still made between the dozens of android phones’ market share to the (now) 3 iPhone models on (now) 3 US cellular providers. 27% market share with (at the time) 2 models on 2 US providers.

Lee Dronick

I just got a press release from Apple. Over 4 million iPhone 4s were sold since the 14th.

mrmwebmax

+

I just got a press release from Apple. Over 4 million iPhone 4s were sold since the 14th.

Clearly, Apple is doomed….

RonMacGuy

I just got a press release from Apple. Over 4 million iPhone 4s were sold since the 14th.

And, I suspect that Apple made more on those 4 million iPhone 4S sales than Samsung, HTC, and Motorola made with their android phone sales in the past 6 months!!

gavron

First, thanks for being polite.  I appreciate the civility.  Second, I’ve never posted anonymously nor have I been on this forum prior to this thread. 

Finally, I said I would stay out of it and I am.  I don’t care how many of whatever Apple sells or how well they do.  I’m a tech guy, not a marketing or sales droid or investor.  Those of you that are happy with their sales and their profit, I hope you’ve put your money where your mouth is.  Otherwise, of course, you’re just fair-weather friends of Apple.

Regards,

Ehud
Tucson AZ US

RonMacGuy

Ehud, please understand that those of us who support Apple get inundated with lots of insults most of the time, so we get a bit sensitive. However, I will say that most of us are receptive to open discussion about the merits of each. I have no issue with android, and agree that Apple, while setting the standard early on with iOS, does need to play “catch up” on some level of innovation that has come about on the android platform in the past 2 years. The openness of android encourages lets say a different type of innovation. The openness also has serious drawbacks, such as the fragmentation of versions of android and the malware issues that continue to crop up.

Being a shareholder of Apple, I see Apple’s financial performance as critical to giving me a better-than-market return on my investment. I also was a Motorola shareholder, seeing some potential there many years ago. However, given the development of the smart phone market, I recently have sold that Motorola stock at basically a flat return on MSI and up due to Google acquisition plans on MMI. To me, it is all about shareholder value, and Apple is set to win there - much more than Samsung, HTC, and Motorola. Google is also set to win there, but I have no appetite for their stock!!

I hope the rocky start here on TMO does not keep you from returning for open debate. As long as you (and the rest of us here) remain open-minded, the discussions can be enjoyable and educational.

Frankly, I will say that although more processor power is good on a PC, I’m just not convinced that quad chips are really needed on a cell phone. Even with Siri, most of the processing is done on the server side. Until some serious apps come out that I can really use and require that level of processing power, I’ll take the increased battery life with a middle-of-the-road processor. But, I am not a serious gamer, which to me seems to be the key driver for faster micros on smart phones.

mhikl

bigMacFan said:
Ouch, just saw the new droid razr, one more nail in apple coffin.? Its thinner, bigger screen, way faster, better camera.? Announced Oct 18th.? My 4s is only a few days old and already its outdated.? Jeesh..

Forgot to add a link for ?evidence?:
http://www.operationandroid.com/content/motorola-droid-razr-thiner-and-faster-iphone-4s/3136659
Droid Razr faster and thinner than iphone 4s

Too cool, bigMacFan or gavron (you are the one and same, eh?)

How were the line-ups for this amazing new droid razr*?
Did they stretch round a telephone pole?

*drat this spell checker.

android rules

How were the line-ups for this amazing new droid razor? Did they stretch round a telephone pole?

Android market share——50% and growing
IOS marketshare——25% and shrinking

Enough said.

mhikl

Ehud, please understand that those of us who support Apple get inundated with lots of insults most of the time, so we get a bit sensitive. However, I will say that most of us are receptive to open discussion about the merits of each.

Ron, I would write one sentence as:

However, I will say that most of us are receptive to intelligent, open discussion about the merits of each.

The problem with Droidophiles is that they are resentful, bitter and come to Apple sites to pick a fight. There is a second reason some might come and that is because of the intelligence of Apple Fan discussions.

Mean while, back at their hog farm, the droid sophisticates are usually wining and crying for help to get their sad equipment functioning as promised. And this I will grant them, the technocrats can server up some good assistance in a droid language that can be bemusing. Of course it just sets a run of requests for further explanation with returns in the same vein.

Really, the best thing to do is to ignore droid trolls, but Apple Fans* are a good sort and like to educate the stupid.^

*Some like to be called Apple Interested, but why not stand tall as a proud Apple Fan.
^ Some Apple Fans aren?t so nice.

mhikl

Oh, how I should love to see a droid line-up, a news-making, gang buster thunderous display of stampeding droidophiles lurching all night in throngs outside a droid store, or at the boot of some rundown automobile waiting to get their droidenstein in their greasy paws. And news breaking reports with pictures of grab and run from any droid kiosk at centre isle in a shopping maul.

Now either would usher in the end of the universe as we now see it.
(edit, almost: I was going to change to mall but maul seems more appropriate.)

Lee Dronick

Popularity of a product or service is not necessarily proof that it is superior. Note that I said “not necessarily,” there are certainly exceptions.

Is Android better than iOS 5 or vice versa?  That is up to each individual user to decide, there are a lot intangibles to factor in for each user’s situation. As for me I prefer the iPhone and Macs over the competition.

Do I put my money where my mouth is? You bet your sweet bippy, I own some AAPL so I have a “steak” in defending Apple’s products from calumny. Of course I also promote Apple products, but what I don’t do is go to Android, Linus, and Windows blogs and tug on Superman’s cape.

Chat with you later.

gavron

I feel less welcome by the moment, and you wonder why android fans don’t come back?  You have your answer.  Read above.

I do not “wine”.  I have no “steak” in AAPL.  However, the next time I’m enjoying a good cabernet with my filet mignon I will toast you guys.  (Perhaps if I had a stake in AAPL I might whine.)

Please remember. the insulting derogatory comments lumping all android fans into various categories and demeaning them on your forum, with the tacit agreement of your members not speaking out—this makes YOU look bad.  It doesn’t change what android fans or Apple fans are.  It does change your forum. 

The next time you feel like complaining about fanbois, remember that when you shove everyone else out, that’s all that remains.

Regards,

Ehud

mrmwebmax

+

I am Ehud Gavron.? I sign all my posts.? Sometimes abbreviated as ?-E? but always signed.

Regards,

Ehud

You say you feel less welcome by the moment. Ever wonder why? If you, and only you, sign off with “E,” look at how this thread started:

Unfortunately experts have an area of expertise?that part of their knowledge in which they know of which they speak.

You think you?re an Apple IOS expert.  You speak confidently about IOS 5, so I assume you have spent all two days becoming an expert at it.

Unfortunately, you?re not an Android expert.  You?re not an Android Market expert.  You?re not an Android Handset expert.  In short, your ramblings with respect to Android, Droid, ecosystems? well.. fanciful dreams in print.

It?s ok.  I see that you write your rants on ?macobserver? and not on ?familiary-with-android? or ?even-have-a-clue-about-anything-other-than-apple-products.?  I don?t expect more.  Neither do your readers, I?m sure.

Shape up.  Or shut up.

E

That user posted as “It’s a good thing to have experts,” but signed with an “E.” Was that you? If so, perhaps you (or whoever posted that) should realize that starting a thread by saying:

In short, your ramblings with respect to Android, Droid, ecosystems? well.. fanciful dreams in print.

It?s ok.  I see that you write your rants on ?macobserver? and not on ?familiary-with-android? or ?even-have-a-clue-about-anything-other-than-apple-products.?  I don?t expect more.  Neither do your readers, I?m sure.

...in which you insult both the author and every reader here, is not going to win you friends anytime soon. Then there’s what “iPhones for free, and so’s your whiskey” wrote:

I?m not worried.  I saw Apple die once before.  Then they came back.  I look forward to the new death.  Perhaps this time they will learn.  Either way they won?t have Steve Jobs to messiah their ass out of the morass they created.

E

Signed with an “E,” which means its you, by your own admission. And what are you saying? That you look forward to the company dying, and that Steve Jobs—who just died FOR REAL—won’t be able to “messiah their ass out of the morass they created”? In an Apple enthusiast forum you say this, and expect what? Roses and chocolates?

Then you took a potshot at me:

I?m sure reading slowly aids your comprehension, and I appreciate your sharing that with me.  I?ve registered for an account so as to confuse you less.  I always sign what I write? so whether you agree with me or not, at least know I stand behind my words and this is not a drive-by fanboi spew.

I asked you to read slowly simply because you missed the point of my original post. I asked you and others to sign up for accounts so you weren’t posting under numerous different names, as you obviously did, unless someone else here was signing posts with an “E,” and surely you would have said if that was the case, so as to not “confuse me less.”

Not a drive-by fanboi spew? When your post—the very first post in this thread—attacks the author of the piece and then every reader of the piece? And now you have the audacity to claim that WE look bad because—yes—some of us (myself included) got royally pi#$ed off at your insulting and derogatory comments?

Finally, as for:

The next time you feel like complaining about fanbois, remember that when you shove everyone else out, that?s all that remains.

Regards,

Ehud

The next time you come into an Apple enthusiast forum and verbally shove everyone here around, don’t expect things to go any better. Do unto others…you know? And remember “E,” the thread was started by you.

Lee Dronick

Ehud, are you the fellow who sold the domain wallstreet.com? If so then that was a sweet deal. You made more money from that than I ever will from my AAPL stock.

gavron

Hey Lee.

I wrote those.  You make good points.  I could have said it better.

Let me clarify the one part… I was not suggesting Apple fail or die.  It was a compliment.  Apple was done before, and Steve Jobs brought it back.  I hope they reinvent themselves again… but this time there is no Steve Jobs.

I apologize for my poor choice of words, and offense I have given.

Ehud

gavron

P.S.  Yes that was I.  My apology still stands.  Regards!

Lee Dronick

I apologize for my poor choice of words, and offense I have given.

I took no offense.

Who knows what will happen to Apple now that Steve Jobs has made the journey. It is quite possible that someone there has great ideas that for whatever reason couldn’t be done under Steve; Where would the Edison business be if Tesla had free reign while working for him.

I wish that I had registered the domain occupywallstreet.com

Gotta run for a while, I have pasta and salad calling me.

mhikl

Hello dear Ehud, Lunatics, bigMacFan and any other moniker you use on our site.

So you claim not to be a troll, eh? So what kind of language do you call this: (starting with Lunatics)

1. Dear mrmgraphics (your real name, I?m sure)
2. You, ma?am are off topic.? To borrow your own advice, despite your lunacy, have the courage to sign your name.
3. I?m sure reading slowly aids your comprehension
4. I apologize that subtraction is not your fort?. - (& other insane twaddle.)
5. Like I said, nobody asked, nobody cared.
6. See, I?ve taught you many things today.? In addition you now know how stupid it is to say ?screen name? or ?HELLO ROOM? in this century.

Now these little nasties are just froth to the beer. Your tempo and mini tantrums abound.

And imagine, picking on my spelling errors, you cad. Most of my fans are decent enough to tell me politely. Then I rap them for their grammar; but you, Ehud, I shan’t say a thing about your lack of style and plethora of irregularities as you may not be a native speaker of this language and especially as I, a lover of all humanity, don’t resort to easy retorts. I go for the juggler when anyone picks on my friends on TMO. And I should kindly suggest you make a note of spelling out that Ehud is a given name. I thought it was some sadistic Masonic curse for good-by. (No offence to Masons, dad.)

And I’ll have you know, mrmgraphics is one of the most eloquent and fair minded individuals to grace any forum and his ideas are insights quoted and admired across continents. And check out his grammar, his punctuation and logic and sense of humour (well, maybe not his sense of humour on this page), but barring none (well maybe not barring Lee aka Sir Harry) his style stands supreme; and that he is heralded by nothing finer than the given name of Michael (God?s #2 Angel- damn that Gabriel) and by a proud, ancient Scottish surname, to boot, puts to rest any slander from the likes of trolls.

And one of these days I’m gong to figure out what the “+” stands for but I bet its something important and until I find out I shall bask in the awareness that when I see “+” I know who is speaking without wasting eye muscles looking for the member’s name. Eyes are forever and we all have to look after them and I appreciate this little curtosy, so there! Now go look for spelling errors, you, you, nasty troll, you!

And if you really are not a nasty troll, then I?m only joking.

mrmgraphics, you beat me to the punch, and your research is impeccable, dang.

gavron

A juggler is a person who juggles objects.

Perhaps you meant jugular—a vein.

I have apologized for my words.

Cheers,

E

mrmwebmax

+

OK, I for one am going to take a long, deep breath, and an even longer sip from my martini. (Tanqueray gin, M&R vermouth, a lone Spanish olive.)

Gavron, yes, you have apologized for your words, and I for one thank you. Apologies don’t happen in this arena too often, and that’s what it’s become, lately: an arena. This is far worse than any Mac vs. Windows fanboi feud I recall, and I do mean “fanboi” for those on either side of the divide, myself included. And sorry if you prefer Ehud over Gavron: Without getting into that argument again, I am used to using screen names, forum names, user names…call them as you will. And no, I’m not a child of the Nineties, but rather the Eighties, and I’ve got the RUSH concert programs to prove it. In any case, no one can deny that you’re being civil, and for that I am grateful, and am withdrawing my sword.

Lee/HF, thanks for being a voice of calm in the troubled sea of this thread. We all—myself included—could stand to learn a lot from you. Calmer heads should always prevail. I remember dating a born-again Christian in college, and going to her church one Sunday—not at all remarkable, except that I was (and still am) an atheist. But we respected one another and got along, and I wasn’t there to shout “There is no God!” And if I had, perhaps they would have still welcomed me, had I gained a quieter voice. Lee, thanks for showing that—hopefully—we can all do the same. And thank you Gavron for being the living example here.

mhikl, my brother-in-arms: We’re always ready to fight the good fight, and I blame neither of us for a single word on this thread. I also thank you for the many fine compliments. Now let’s all, again, take a deep breath, and (your mileage may vary) a deep sip, and remember that any enemy lost is an ally gained, even if we disagree. That’s something I learned in my girlfriend’s church, and is an appropriate metaphor, given the religious devotion we all seem to share with iOS vs. Android.

Again, wow, this makes Mac vs. Windows look like a walk through the park.

Sincerely,
mrmgraphics (‘cause I love that forum/screen/domain name!)

PS—mhikl, yes, the “+” has deep significance to me. Long story. Only a handful of people know what it really means. But it is part of who I am, and thanks for noticing. smile

RonMacGuy

mrmgraphics, now I’m offended that you didn’t even mention me in your response.  I, like Lee, was trying to be sort of a voice of calm here too!!  Only mhikl thinks of me anymore…  (sniff).

grin

Plus, now I’m really curious about the +.  Perhaps someday you will share the story.

I kind of like Ehud, even though the beginning was a bit rough.  Stick around, Ehud, it gets better!!  Plus, you’ve just GOT to meet Bosco here!!  Am I right, guys?  wink

Lee Dronick

Lee/HF, thanks for being a voice of calm in the troubled sea of this thread. We all?myself included?could stand to learn a lot from you.

Your welcome, and I can, and do, learn from others.

I was a warrior once and it is still just under the surface, but I have long learned it is better to defuse a situation than clean up the gore afterwards.

Again, wow, this makes Mac vs. Windows look like a walk through the park.

Yes, and was in that since the days of Apple II. Many of us old timers are defensive of our choice to be Apple users and as such we can react to an attack or perceived attack.

Screen names. Last week I made the decision that I would transition to my real name. A couple of the regulars here knew of my plans. Henceforth I am who I am. Not that I was hidden before, I long had contact info in profile.

I’ll be up for while, but I have book to devour.

gavron

Hey guys, thanks for chiming in.  I didn’t leave anybody out on purpose.  I said I would not be adding fuel to the fire… so I tried to stay out.

I appreciate your welcome.  I really do always sign my name.  I’ve never posted anonymously without doing so (I was not registered with the forum, but I still signed it.)

Apple makes great products.  The market (supply and demand) speaks.  I think the original author was inaccurate… (and said so)..  Android products (made by many suppliers) are great.  A choice in selection is a great thing.

Thank you for welcoming me.  Honestly I am sorry for my attitude.  I’m better than that… but admittedly I could stand to learn to hold my tongue before schooling those around me.

Cheers,

Ehud

mhikl

To come into someone’s home and then mock their furnishing and style comparing it with your own home is not accepted in any society. On a forum devoted to all things tech, go in and say what you want and be willing to hear what others may say about your favourite brand. For the most part, I don’t spend much time on such forums because I do not like anger. I hang out with my own kind because that is where my interests lie.

Android interested are welcome if they come to learn about Apple just as I am sure an Apple devote would be welcome at an Android site. And I would expect some gentle ribbing from time to time. But to come to any forum as a newbie and charge in as if one knows it all, now that is rude behaviour. One bides his/er time and learns; learns about the forum members, learns how business is conducted and this should all be done well before entering discussions. But the vast majority of Android posters either come to a) berate our hardware and the company we are attuned to (doing so right off the bat), or b) come assuming we are all blind Apple fanatics who can’t see any moles on our products or the company that innovates them. In the first instance, we, as an Apple interest forum, have a right to learn, a right to discuss and assist each other with Apple concerns, all without people with personal problems coming in and sidetracking our forum. In the second instance, TMO members, and its editors and column contributors, regulars and guests, all take issue with errors they find in Apple design and decisions. John M did such a job this past week. I repeat, we are not blind, we are not dumb, in knowledge or tongue, when it comes to Apple folly. And we like to hear about shenanigans when discovered. But cross our line, use numerous aliases, attack our writers, mess with our members, then expect to be answered as a rude guest in your home should be answered. We have had so many attacks by non-member, single name contributors lately, it is become tiring. But cone with grace and welcomed you shall be received.

So let me not be the last to welcome Ehud and any honest sentient being to the Great TMO. It?s more than just another Apple tech discussion forum.

And Ron, Indeed, I have noticed the voice of calm in your latest posts. I?m at standing guard with my rubber chicken as my sword.

And mrmgraphics, what is Rush? Before my time? What you do after a pub crawl?

And I knew it, the + has significance! I have people sense, but not much sense with homophones and other weird word things.

Lee, I just get used to the Harry Flashman followed by Lee and you dash off another change. I like it. Too bad we can?t have signatures at the end of our postings but without graphics.

Finally, I?d be a pretty sorry Canadian if I didn?t know Rush, number two after Arcade Fire on my iPt.

mrmwebmax

+

mrmgraphics, now I?m offended that you didn?t even mention me in your response.? I, like Lee, was trying to be sort of a voice of calm here too!!? Only mhikl thinks of me anymore?? (sniff).

Plus, now I?m really curious about the +.? Perhaps someday you will share the story.

No slight intended, RMG. I was just feeling a bit benevolent (no doubt because I’d just completed my taxes, late filing as always), and wanted to get it all down before the feeling passed. smile

As for the +? Well, best said, what’s life without a little mystery? Is there a Loch Ness Monster? Why is RUSH still not in the Rock & Roll Hall of Fame? What’s the meaning of the +? These questions will surely challenge scholars for many years to come….

RonMacGuy

Ehud, welcome aboard.  mrmgraphics, no worries - I was joking, as I’m sure you surmised.  And mhikl, at ease, put down the chicken, and go download some RUSH for goodness sake!!

And, in honor of mrmgraphics ‘+’ sign, I need to find my own symbol and start to use it.  Unless that would upset you, mrm.  Copying is the sincerest form of flattery, right?

Maybe @% based on my lucky numbers of 2 and 5…

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