Free Speech & Political Correctness

  • Posted: 30 June 2001 01:51 PM #31

    On 2001-06-30 16:28, Anonymous wrote:
    Well, at my school all the black guys call each other “nigger”

    Actually, the correct pronunciation is “nigga.”

    Rodney “The whitest black guy on the Mac web” Lain

     

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  • Posted: 30 June 2001 04:03 PM #32

    On 2001-06-30 16:28, Anonymous wrote:
    But I believe we should be able to say what we want, whether it is insulting another race, another sex, gays, baptists, jews or anyone else… but we should have the right to do it.

    Seems like two issues are involved here. One is the right of an individual to express himself or herself (itself - if you’re a Mac ). I don’ think that is the original issue. The other one directly relates to Rodney and the the first amendment, namely the public proclamation of a point of view. At the public discourse level there is a difference between effective persuasion, using a word/phrase to emphasize a point (which I think, Rodney, you do quite effectively) and brash attempts to say/write anything that is disgusting to someone else. I guess I would call the second gratuitous violence/language abuse/etc. While an author might consider it a “right” to do so, the “in your face” vulgarity and violence (in movies, for example) really cheapens the language and detracts from the point being made. That is why I appreciate an author who can challenge me to think even if I don’t agree with his/her position; I don’t have much patience for those who try to feed me intellectual pablum (poorly thought out and presented hyper-junk talk) that is laced with the latest vulgarity, etc. Sadly there is so much of this latter kind that it is discouraging to read. But as I advise my students: be selective in reading. Read the best in whatever field.

    While there are stimulating writers in the Mac arena (Rodney, Charles, James, etc.) much of what is written in the Mac field succumbs to this watered down currency. And sadly, writers of this kind of intellectual light-weight stuff try to dominate the internet and claim that it is just as valid as the truly good writing. This is not a knock on any message board in particular, but…message boards can contribute to this sense that everyone’s argument is equally valid just because it appears in “print,” regardless of whether it is articulated coherently.

    So, Rodney write on, and challenge us to think as we read, so that we do not react with the latest fleeting thought/emotion that you happen to trigger.

    [As a side note. I have taught at the college and post graduate level for 15 years (not full time). I too am appalled at the (lack of) grammar and the ability to express oneself, even at the postgraduate level. Had I used for 9th grade English class some of the papers I graded in post-graduate school, I wouldn’t have made it out of the 9th grade!]

    <font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: shades on 2001-06-30 19:20 ]</font>

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    Posted: 30 June 2001 04:21 PM #33

    Well said all around, Shades.  I want to add that even the things you characterized as “abuse” still *have* to be protected.  For instance, Flag Burning is an assuredly offensive act (to me), but it is an act which *must be protected*.  The thing tat I always find so ironic about it is that those who do so are protesting a country that allows them to do so in the first place.  In any event, we must protect all forms of *public* speech, no matter how offensive.

    Please note that there is a difference between public speech and speech in a private forum (double meaning not intended).

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  • Posted: 30 June 2001 06:28 PM #34

    HOM…
    I believe a lot of people have fought to give us these rights and a lot of people still stand to allow us to continue to have these rights.  I thank them everyday.
    Question is are we willing to back their sacrifices?  I sincerely hope that each of us has something in us that will not allow these sacrifices to be stomped on and made to seem trite.
    To me political correctness seems to narrow our ability to tolerate others and their beliefs.

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  • Posted: 03 July 2001 12:36 AM #35

    nigga and nigger mean the same thing. they just pronounce it as nigga because it sounds cooler.

    so lets get off the free speech topic and on to gun rights….

         
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    Posted: 03 July 2001 01:09 AM #36

    Well said, Psbr!

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  • Posted: 03 July 2001 11:40 AM #37

    On 2001-07-03 03:36, Anonymous wrote:
    nigga and nigger mean the same thing. they just pronounce it as nigga because it sounds cooler.

    Actually, a nigga is cooler than a nigger

    so lets get off the free speech topic and on to gun rights….

    Praise the Lord and pass the ammunition!

     

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  • Posted: 03 July 2001 04:37 PM #38

    Shoot, we’ll probably have to have another thread to determine which Lord, huh?

    [this is on topic of gun control - “shoot” ]

    <font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: shades on 2001-07-03 19:38 ]</font>

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  • Posted: 09 July 2001 03:59 PM #39

    On 2001-06-28 10:15, HOM wrote:
    It is about time that people started to talk about the liberal facisim that has taken over the country. I think that there is a responsibility of the people that use “offensive” word not to use them unless there is a good reason. Mr. Lain’s use of nigger was as good a use as there can be because the word implies hatred that I belive he was trying to convey. There is also a responsibility on the listener/reader to not give the words any power. If a listener does not give any weight to those words, then they loose their power. If someone calls me a kyke for being Jewish I don’t give it a second thought because I know that I am not one,  nor will I let that person have that power over me. The problem is when the government, not editors, start telling us what words to use. Everyday that I hear a person complain about a word I think more and more of leaving the country.


    Where would you go?

         
  • Posted: 10 July 2001 09:57 AM #40

    Holland

         
  • Posted: 10 July 2001 11:51 AM #41

    Nooo, come to Australia.

    Not only are we blessed with free speech, but we also have better beer.  And when we play football, we don’t wear padding and stop for a rest every twenty seconds. 









    oh, that’s right… I was going to say something useful here.

    Says psbr:

    To me political correctness seems to narrow our ability to tolerate others and their beliefs.

    We-e-e-ell, it depends on which bit you’re talking about.  I know at least that in written and spoken language, making sure that what you’ve said is non-exclusive is a great way to show your ability to be tolerant.  At the very least, it’s courteous.

     

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  • Posted: 10 July 2001 08:59 PM #42

    On 2001-07-10 14:51, Raena wrote:
    Nooo, come to Australia.

    Not only are we blessed with free speech, but we also have better beer. 

    oh, that’s right… I was going to say something useful here.

    You did: you said something about beer.

    I’m not joking

     

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  • Posted: 12 July 2001 12:11 AM #43

    Eheheh, neither was I.  I’ve tried Budweiser, and it reminds me of bathwater.

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  • Posted: 12 July 2001 02:10 AM #44

    On 2001-07-10 12:57, HOM wrote:
    Holland

    How is Holland better than the USA regarding free speech? Or other personal freedoms?

    Have you ever been there/lived there?

         
  • Posted: 12 July 2001 10:07 AM #45

    On 2001-07-12 05:10, Anonymous wrote:

    How is Holland better than the USA regarding free speech? Or other personal freedoms?

    Have you ever been there/lived there?

    Yes, I have been there for an extended period of time. In Holland there is a strong belief in personal liberty. They allow prostitution, assisted suicide, limited drug use, and very strong restrictions on police. In fact there is a large statue outside the national museum in Amsterdam that is a man in a business suit with a briefcase in one hand and a tourch in the other. It is called the “Statue of no liberty”. When I saw this I looked into it some more and rest asured they kick America’s ass when it comes to upholding the principals set forth in the Bill of Rights.