iPhone v. Palm Pre Pricing

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    Posted: 09 June 2009 05:24 PM #16

    I and a lot of people visit DealMac daily and I’m sure a lot of business is guided by this wonderful site.  They have put together a comprhensive comparison of the Pre and iPhone and have chosen iPhone winner.

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  • Posted: 09 June 2009 05:52 PM #17

    spudgeek - 09 June 2009 03:54 PM

    - Sprint:  I believe $99 for unlimited voice, data, and text
    - AT&T:  I believe $99 unlimited voice, $30 unlimited data (will increase for tethering), $10 for 200 text messages… then add the international calling and text)... AT&T services are astronomical and not attractive for many.

    There’s been a few responses to my quote so I’ll just say this:
    a) I did mean “moot” - thanks capablanca.

    b) I use my iPhone for business and personal use and need the unlimited voice plan because lesser plans ran me into overage charges that just became ridiculous. So the reason I quoted the unlimited voice plan was to show that big difference bw Sprint & AT&T. The differnce is very apparent when you have multiple phones.
    I cannot believe that AT&T prices need to be so high (or Verizon for that matter). European charges are much more palatable and rates are per second and not per minute which is only fair really - why should we pay for ten minutes for 10 x 10-second calls… multiply that up for all users and tell me that we’re not all being ripped off.

    c) I know I’m in a minority group, but I have family in Europe and I think that’s a pretty big group. PATS mentioned that Pre is CDMA so international roaming isn’t available anyway (thanks Pats)... (think CDMA may be in Asia)... anyway, GSM or CDMA, some of us receive international calls to cell phones in the USA and they accrue pretty hefty charges so our friendly networks offer us standing monthly fees to lessen the pain (but still hurts)... it’s the same deal for international texts. Don’t get me started on the international data plans - they’re in planet hilarious… If you don’t have the need for international services then you won’t care but someone should be looking out for the consumers!

    All said and done… I’m just highlighting - I don’t mean to complain as I have a choice and mine is iPhone and AT&T.

    [ Edited: 09 June 2009 05:54 PM by spudgeek ]      
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    Posted: 09 June 2009 06:14 PM #18

    Spudgeek

    We all like to rant about the cost of things, and personally I think ATT has some room to cut cost to consumers, but part of the whole pricing discussion is a smoke screen.  If the upfront cost of the iphone was not subsidized then it would appear high and ATT would not attract as many users to their data network.  The subsidy has worked extremely well for ATT.  Given that they have plenty of room to improve their network, maybe the extra dollars will actually result in improved service.  If we just look at text the amount of data in a text message vs the cost is hilarious from a bandwidth perspective, but if you are in the texting demographic then you are stuck with an extra $20 per month from ATT even though it uses a trickle of data compared to 30 per month for 5GB of 3G tethering.  The carriers are struggling with data pricing.  Back in the days of analog modems we were happy to get the internet for 19.99 per month at 56K baud so I don’t think 20-30 is way out of line for mobile 3G connection but to me comparing the Iphone to the PRE on a pure device basis without the subsidy on a good GSM network when the PRE is available on one and the Iphone wins hands down.  The ATT plan for unlimited voice sucks compared to Sprint so if you like Sprint then the PRE is an excellent choice.

         
  • Posted: 09 June 2009 06:38 PM #19

    pats - 09 June 2009 09:14 PM

      If the upfront cost of the iphone was not subsidized then it would appear high and ATT would not attract as many users to their data network.  The subsidy has worked extremely well for ATT.

    All phones in the US (at least on major carriers) are subsidized, including the Pre.  The original iPhone was an exception.

    With the price of data plans, the $100 dollar price difference should make little difference.  The $99 iPhone might also suffer from being “last-gen” technology.  I suspect the $99 iPhone will attract users looking at getting a cheaper basic phone (like the ones that sell for $50) and decide that at a sub-$100 price point, they can look at the iPhone instead.

         
  • Posted: 09 June 2009 11:12 PM #20

    I currently have four iPhones on my family plan. Soon it will be five iPhones on the plan. For $30 per month I have unlimited texting on all lines. We share 2100 minutes on a family plan and I’m swimming in rollover minutes. Each additional iPhone on the plan costs $9.99 per month plus the data plan. Most calls are in network and much of our communication is via of text messaging.

    When I divide the total cost of the monthly plan by 4 currently (and soon by 5), add in the value-added benefits of the MobileMe Family Plan in terms of integration of information of each user on the Macs at home I’m quite pleased with the economics of the iPhone. The two students on the plan constantly use their phones for school-related work including Web research.

    We can talk about stand-alone pricing all we want. But I’d say a goodly percentage of iPhone users are on family plans which dramatically changes the economics.

         
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    Posted: 10 June 2009 05:38 PM #21

    ISuppli: Palm’s Pre Uses Some Surprising Components, Designs
    Last update: 6/10/2009 4:30:08 PM

      DOW JONES NEWSWIRES

    Texas Instruments Inc. (TXN), Qualcomm Inc. (QCOM), Sony Corp. (SNE) and Samsung Electronics Co. (SSNHY) are the main suppliers of parts for Palm Inc.‘s (PALM) new Pre, according to a breakdown by iSuppli Corp.
    “With the Pre, Palm has made some surprising choices not only in the phone’s features, but also in its design and component selection,” said Andrew Rassweiler of iSuppli.

    Among those surprising choices is the Pre’s use of two gigabits of SDRAM, double what is in Apple Inc.‘s (AAPL) iPhone and most other smartphones.

    The larger amount of memory “likely is needed as a buffer to support the Pre’s capability to multitask various applications,” iSuppli said.

    Also, the Pre doesn’t use Qualcomm’s PM6650 chip, which performs the power-management function in almost all Qualcomm-based designs. Rather, the Pre uses Maxim Integrated Products Inc.‘s (MXIM) MAX8695 power-management integrated circuit, which also is in the LG Voyager VX10000.

    In addition, the Pre employs eight gigabytes of Samsung’s eMMC MoviNAND flash memory, rather than regular Multi-Level Cell NAND commonly found in mobile phones. EMMC is a premium variety of NAND flash memory that combines high-density MLC NAND flash with a memory management controller to deliver higher performance and easier integration into electronic designs, iSuppli said.

    The largest cost driver in the Pre is Sony’s advanced Low-Temperature Polysilicon LCD display, which with Pre’s touch screen module, costs $39.50.

    The Pre, which Palm began selling Saturday, costs just under $200, though at most stores, that price is only after a $100 mail-in rebate from Sprint Nextel Corp. (S).

    -By Kathy Shwiff, Dow Jones Newswires; 201-938-5975; .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address)
    (END) Dow Jones Newswires
    June 10, 2009 16:30 ET (20:30 GMT)

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    Posted: 10 June 2009 06:57 PM #22

    For those keeping score.  According to Electonista  

    Apple’s 3GS SOC and the TI SOC in the PRE are close cousins.

    Specifications listed at the Netherlands T-Mobile website appear to confirm that the iPhone 3GS integrates 256MB of RAM

    The carrier also lists a 600MHz CPU, which could corroborate earlier reports that the device uses Samsung’s ARM Cortex A8.

    The new handsets reportedly integrate the PowerVR SGX graphics processor core, which enables support for OpenGL ES 2.0, according to AppleInsider. The System on a Chip (SoC) graphics components are allegedly being produced as a result of secret licensing agreements between Samsung, Imagination and Apple.

    AnanTech IT portal has a detailed look at the 3Gs

    As I mentioned earlier, the Palm Pre uses a similar combination of hardware to what I expect from the iPhone 3GS. TI?s OMAP 3430 combines a Cortex A8 CPU core with a PowerVR SGX 530 GPU. The difference is that while the Pre uses its excess horsepower to enable user-level application multitasking, Apple won?t be. The Pre is most definitely faster than the iPhone, but it still has some rough edges. Combine the power of the Pre with the highly optimized software stack of the iPhone and you?ve got the recipe of an extremely fast iPhone. While I?ve yet to play with one, on paper, the 3GS should be every bit as fast as the videos make it seem.

    Article comparing battery life of existing Iphone 3g vs Palm Pre and G1 Here
    Apple claims a significant improvement in battery life for the 3Gs vs 3G so the 3Gs should provide better performance and battery life a nice combination

    Phone   Web Browsing (Cell Network)  Web Browsing (WiFi)  Talk Time
    Apple iPhone 3G   218 minutes   400 minutes   289 minutes
    Palm Pre   219 minutes   351 minutes   312 minutes
    T-Mobile G1   398 minutes (on Edge)  435 minutes   218 minutes (on Edge)

         
  • Posted: 16 June 2009 08:44 PM #23

    I wonder who this is aimed at?

    iTunes: About unsupported third-party digital media players
    Last Modified: June 16, 2009
    Article: HT3642

    Summary
    This article is about iTunes and unsupported third-party digital media players.

    Products Affected:
    iTunes

    Apple designs the hardware and software to provide seamless integration of the iPhone and iPod with iTunes, the iTunes Store, and tens of thousands of apps on the App Store. Apple is aware that some third-parties claim that their digital media players are able to sync with Apple software. However, Apple does not provide support for, or test for compatibility with, non-Apple digital media players and, because software changes over time, newer versions of Apple’s iTunes software may no longer provide syncing functionality with non-Apple digital media players.

    http://support.apple.com/kb/HT3642

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  • Posted: 16 June 2009 10:42 PM #24

    rattyuk - 16 June 2009 11:44 PM

    I wonder who this is aimed at?

    iTunes: About unsupported third-party digital media players
    Last Modified: June 16, 2009
    Article: HT3642

    Summary
    This article is about iTunes and unsupported third-party digital media players.

    Products Affected:
    iTunes

    Apple designs the hardware and software to provide seamless integration of the iPhone and iPod with iTunes, the iTunes Store, and tens of thousands of apps on the App Store. Apple is aware that some third-parties claim that their digital media players are able to sync with Apple software. However, Apple does not provide support for, or test for compatibility with, non-Apple digital media players and, because software changes over time, newer versions of Apple’s iTunes software may no longer provide syncing functionality with non-Apple digital media players.

    http://support.apple.com/kb/HT3642

    hmmmmmmm…......

    let me think…..........

    starts with a “P”???  lol
    tongue laugh

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  • Posted: 16 June 2009 11:22 PM #25

    Hmmm….

    Posted today (June 16th). Just in time for tomorrow and iPhone 3.0. Two years is a long time to hear friends and associates say, “you should have bought an iPhone for $99 instead.”

         
  • Posted: 17 June 2009 01:08 AM #26

    I think Palm did a nice job targeting the 3G at the $199. Targeting the $99 3G or $199 3GS… not so much.

    RE: Battery life comparisons

    Too bad the 3GS wasn’t included.

    During the WWDC keynote, there was a slide comparing 3G vs 3GS battery life. What’s the secret behind the 3GS being superior on every measure but only meeting the 3G at 5 hours for “3G talk”? Does the new device draw more power for 3G talk to derive better reception?

         
  • Posted: 17 June 2009 07:46 AM #27

    DawnTreader - 17 June 2009 02:22 AM

    Hmmm….

    Posted today (June 16th). Just in time for tomorrow and iPhone 3.0. Two years is a long time to hear friends and associates say, “you should have bought an iPhone for $99 instead.”

    I’ve *never*, even *once* regretted buying my iPhone on launch day.  I don’t even *remember* how much I paid for my iPhone (was it $499? $599?), but it was worth every single penny and then some.  I can’t remember feeling that way about too many *things* in my life.  THAT is saying something for a “gadget”, which is what “they” seemed to think it was.  :-D

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    Posted: 17 June 2009 10:44 AM #28

    cranium - 17 June 2009 04:08 AM

    I think Palm did a nice job targeting the 3G at the $199. Targeting the $99 3G or $199 3GS… not so much.

    RE: Battery life comparisons

    Too bad the 3GS wasn’t included.

    During the WWDC keynote, there was a slide comparing 3G vs 3GS battery life. What’s the secret behind the 3GS being superior on every measure but only meeting the 3G at 5 hours for “3G talk”? Does the new device draw more power for 3G talk to derive better reception?


    My guess without further research is the new chipset is more efficient but if it is operating at the 7.2 Mbits, it will require greater power.  Speed and power go hand and hand.  On the 2G edge network you get the 20% improvement.  In real life you normally don’t spend the whole time with the 3G chipset powered up so you should have noticeably better battery life.  If you are running short you can always power down the 3G chipset.