I think the Apple TV has potential but needs a few more extras in order to really get my attention. Namely, I think it needs an app store.

A couple months ago I found myself needing a hub for a media center to use with a new 42” HDTV. There were two main options in my mind as a Mac fan: A Mac mini or an Apple TV. I briefly considered the Apple TV option, but it didn’t really have a chance because of the following drawbacks:
- No NetFlix on the Apple TV
- No Hulu on the Apple TV
- No Pandora on the Apple TV
- No easy installation of other services/players/codecs/etc.
- No web/email (which could be easily operated with an optional Bluetooth keyboard)

Sure, the Apple TV is cheaper, but in my mind it’s not worth sacrificing so much functionality to save a couple hundred dollars. With an App Store all of these things could easily be added and would greatly enhance the value of an Apple TV. But sadly they do not exist, so I purchased a Mac mini on Craigslist instead.

I’m not bashing the Apple TV by any means, but I think there are a lot of people out there like me. People who would gladly drop the money on an Apple TV, but don’t see the value in a relatively small savings over a Mac mini (or even a cheap PC) when they can’t stream from third-party media sources, or really do do anything other than watch videos and listen to music.

Right now the Apple TV is basically an iPod Classic for your TV. I think it needs to be an iPod touch for your TV, in terms of functionality.

This might be an interesting add-on Apple’s iTunes Pitch: TV for $30 a Month

From the WSJ

Would you pay $30 a month to watch TV via iTunes?

That’s the pitch Apple has been making to TV networks in recent weeks. The company is trying to round up support for a monthly subscription service that would deliver TV programs via its multimedia software, multiple sources tell me.

I agree that Apple need to open the door to IPTV and real time streams of sporting events also gaming and associated SDK makes sense.  I was running BOXEE during the early Alpha on the ATV but streams from HULU were not all the great on the big screen so I think Apple needs a hardware refresh.  I would hope Apple ties a few of their technologies to the next hardware iteration.  HTTP streaming and Apple Remote via multi-touch are ripe for enhancements to the existing ATV.

That could be an interesting addition. I’d consider paying $20 or $30 monthly for a service that offered unlimited streaming of iTunes movies and TV content through the Apple TV and Front Row. Just having that as an option would add a lot more value to the standard Apple TV, as it would no longer be limited to what’s already in my iTunes library.

What does it need to do? Work as a cable box or blue ray player.

Apple doesn’t need to tie Apple TV to old solutions like TV channels or physical media. It needs to deliver the benefits we like about those without the baggage they bring along. Apple TV is currently just an iPod for your living room.

I have Apple TV; I barely use it except as an iTunes remote speaker, and to show family photos to visitors. It’s too slow, and too badly integrated with other AV components; and the controls are miserable compared to PC/Mac.

It’s not just Apple; nobody delivers what I want: to choose what and when I watch (happy to pay for content rental), not have to skip over the adverts or have DOGs or in-your-face bimbos talking over the open/close of the program (we even get mini video overlays on content advertising the next program now). Current best solution: wait for release on DVD’s; rip with Handbrake (to get rid of embedded junk); watch, then sell the DVD on Ebay if the content isn’t wanted again.

I used to say Apple could do well with encrypted satellite content, sold via the iTunes store. The benefit: near universal geographic coverage with huge bandwidth, real time broadcast capability, easy transition to pure internet distribution when the bandwidth is finally available everywhere. But it’s a temporary solution and the window is already closing.

The iPhone App store shows that Apple can have success if they construct a trusted way to deliver content from creator to consumer, and cash from consumer to creator. I presume the reason that hasn’t been done yet is that Apple still hopes to get Hollywood, TV, and other big publishers on board, and those don’t want to be cut out of the chain. I say cut ‘em out; let’s get on with the future before I’m dead.

what does apple tv need?

well, living here in switzerland, the answer is quite simple:
CONTENT!

we still have no movies and we still have no tv shows in the itunes store.
and this almost 4 years (?) after the product was introduced.

this, imo, is an embarrassment for apple.

i do not know if any other countries have similar problems but it sure is disappointing and frustrating . . .

I don’t really need an app store or any new features on my Apple TV. I just want more content, and it’s obvious that the video businesses are just not interested in helping Apple right now. Apple can’t really make the Apple TV anything more than a hobby until there’s more content, but the movie and TV businesses are just terrified of the train that’s coming at them, so everything is moving far too slowly.

When I find something I want to see on the Apple TV—my wife and I first got hooked on “The Wire,” then “The Tudors,” and now “Damages”—it’s great. I’d like faster downloads of HD, but I’m not going to pay $150 per month for that.

In the next few years, the “social contract” with movie and TV businesses will change radically, and Apple will be in pretty good position to take advantage of that.

But right now they’re right to treat Apple TV as a “hobby.” People get hooked on iPhone apps and features because they NEED a mobile phone and mobile Internet. But very few people look at a TV and say “I wish it did more.” My wife thinks only of what’s on TV, on our DVR or what’s in the house from Netflix. She’d have to be desperately bored to think of using the Apple TV, and most of the time she doesn’t even think of it at all—it’s “my” gadget. I don’t think that’s going to change for quite a while.

David Nelson - 02 November 2009 12:23 PM

A couple months ago I found myself needing a hub for a media center to use with a new 42” HDTV. There were two main options in my mind as a Mac fan: A Mac mini or an Apple TV. I briefly considered the Apple TV option, but it didn’t really have a chance because of the following drawbacks:
- No NetFlix on the Apple TV
- No Hulu on the Apple TV
- No Pandora on the Apple TV
- No easy installation of other services/players/codecs/etc.
- No web/email (which could be easily operated with an optional Bluetooth keyboard)

Well, given your interests, the Mac mini is a good choice but Apple TV has advantages too:

- syncs accurately to your TV on a pure plug-and-play basis
- provides appliance-like simplicity and reliability
- very compact, totally silent, and self-contained
- seamlessly accepts media from other computers on your network
- provides an HDMI connection and is therefore compatible with industry DRM schemes (e.g. HDCP)
- supports true, discrete 5.1 digital surround sound
- supports the iPhone/iPod touch as a graphical remote control
- automatic software updating

...I think there are a lot of people out there like me. People who would gladly drop the money on an Apple TV, but don’t see the value in a relatively small savings over a Mac mini (or even a cheap PC) when they can’t stream from third-party media sources, or really do do anything other than watch videos and listen to music.

...and watch movies ripped, purchased, or rented—even in HD with true 5.1 sound, buy and watch TV shows (again, in HD), see movie trailers (in HD), listen to music and music videos from your own libraries or directly purchased and access streaming audio from hundreds of Internet radio stations, watch podcasts (many in HD), and view slideshows in HD from your own libraries and from flickr and MobileMe galleries.

Other than that, not very useful. 

It seems to me you really strained to make your point, David. However, I do agree that an App Store for Apple TV is a terrific idea.

Apple Investor - 02 November 2009 06:17 PM

I’d like faster downloads of HD, but I’m not going to pay $150 per month for that.

I’m confused by that comment. I have a moderately fast (10 Mbps / $50 per month) cable connection. Rented HD movies from the iTunes Store are almost always ready to watch—interruption-free—within two or three minutes of pressing the OK button. Is that not fast enough?

deasys - 03 November 2009 01:07 AM

I’m confused by that comment. I have a moderately fast (10 Mbps / $50 per month) cable connection. Rented HD movies from the iTunes Store are almost always ready to watch—interruption-free—within two or three minutes of pressing the OK button. Is that not fast enough?

Doesn’t work that well for me, or that reliably well, with a 15-17 Mbps connection. Nearly every time I download an HD movie or TV show, I play it when the Apple TV tells me it’s ready to watch, and I get a white screen. I’ve noted this on the Apple Support Discussion boards, and it appears this happens to other people as well. If I let the download go for a few hours or overnight, then it works OK. I guess on my Apple TV, for whatever reason, the whole video source has to be on the machine for it to play correctly.

Apple Investor - 03 November 2009 08:30 AM

deasys - 03 November 2009 01:07 AM

I’m confused by that comment. I have a moderately fast (10 Mbps / $50 per month) cable connection. Rented HD movies from the iTunes Store are almost always ready to watch—interruption-free—within two or three minutes of pressing the OK button. Is that not fast enough?

Doesn’t work that well for me, or that reliably well, with a 15-17 Mbps connection. Nearly every time I download an HD movie or TV show, I play it when the Apple TV tells me it’s ready to watch, and I get a white screen. I’ve noted this on the Apple Support Discussion boards, and it appears this happens to other people as well. If I let the download go for a few hours or overnight, then it works OK. I guess on my Apple TV, for whatever reason, the whole video source has to be on the machine for it to play correctly.

Have you tested your network connection.  Sounds like a throttling problem from the ISP.  If you truly have 15 Mbps the HD movies weigh in at a couple Gig so something is up are you using a router?

I’m not going to buy a new HDTV simply so I can use Apple TV.  End of story.

pats - 03 November 2009 08:58 AM

Apple Investor - 03 November 2009 08:30 AM

deasys - 03 November 2009 01:07 AM

I’m confused by that comment. I have a moderately fast (10 Mbps / $50 per month) cable connection. Rented HD movies from the iTunes Store are almost always ready to watch—interruption-free—within two or three minutes of pressing the OK button. Is that not fast enough?

Doesn’t work that well for me, or that reliably well, with a 15-17 Mbps connection. Nearly every time I download an HD movie or TV show, I play it when the Apple TV tells me it’s ready to watch, and I get a white screen. I’ve noted this on the Apple Support Discussion boards, and it appears this happens to other people as well. If I let the download go for a few hours or overnight, then it works OK. I guess on my Apple TV, for whatever reason, the whole video source has to be on the machine for it to play correctly.

Have you tested your network connection.  Sounds like a throttling problem from the ISP.  If you truly have 15 Mbps the HD movies weigh in at a couple Gig so something is up are you using a router?

Pats has a good suggestion there: Apple TV has a built-in network test function that you can access under the Settings: General: Network menu.

rpaege - 03 November 2009 10:56 AM

I’m not going to buy a new HDTV simply so I can use Apple TV.  End of story.

If your TV has component video inputs (Y Pb Pr), Apple TV will support even standard definition (SD) TVs (480p).

I’m really hoping that Apple TV will eventually become the ONE box you have in your living room that serves content; audio to stereo and video to your TV. So I’d like it to act as my cablebox, DVR (buy TiVo already Steve!), iPhoto library, and iTunes library. Basically if it involves media of any kind it is served up by the AppleTV. Then I could get rid of all of the cable spaghetti, power hogs, and space that I have now. Given what I’m looking for it would take some unthinkable synergy in the media business to pull off, but that’s where I hope it heads.

Maybe Steve can buy Time Warner Cable and Comcast too?

The AppleTV could replace my Mac mini HTPC if it could

1. Allow me to watch the live streaming video from TWiT.TV Live.
1b. Access TWiT.tv content “on demand” like the Roku can (will?)
2. Allow me to access the NASCAR Raceview live audio and animated telemetry..
3. General Web Browsing - Going to wikipedia or IMDB when I need to argue just who that is playing the murderer, and if it’s the same guy we watched on the 4400… sigh… or, if I want to google something I just saw on TV..
4. Casual gaming like Lux.. or even iPod Touch/iPhone based games..

Nothing here that’s high impact actually needing a Mac mini… If the iPhone can do most of the above, it’d be nice to see the AppleTV improved to this level.