Apple Sues HTC

  • Posted: 03 March 2010 10:51 AM #16

    TanToday - 03 March 2010 02:01 PM

    So, in short, as I said the other day, I see PALM as a failing company, with a HUGE hidden gem, the OS for handsets, leading me to believe that it is a red hot takeover candidate, and given it’s financial death spiral, it most likely would not even be a hostile takeover, meaning quick, fast, and profitable.

    I am not so convinced. Hopefully your bet will earn money but I think Palm, by association, are probably going to fall for many of the same issues. Just if Apple went for them they would just look like a bully.

    Palm, selling Palm handsets, haven’t made it work so far. What makes you think that a competitor could do anything better with it?

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    Posted: 03 March 2010 10:59 AM #17

    rattyuk - 03 March 2010 02:51 PM
    TanToday - 03 March 2010 02:01 PM

    So, in short, as I said the other day, I see PALM as a failing company, with a HUGE hidden gem, the OS for handsets, leading me to believe that it is a red hot takeover candidate, and given it’s financial death spiral, it most likely would not even be a hostile takeover, meaning quick, fast, and profitable.

    I am not so convinced. Hopefully your bet will earn money but I think Palm, by association, are probably going to fall for many of the same issues. Just if Apple went for them they would just look like a bully.

    Palm, selling Palm handsets, haven’t made it work so far. What makes you think that a competitor could do anything better with it?

    It isn’t important THAT I THINK this is a company {PALM} saving operating system, what is important if SOMEONE ELSE sees webOS as their golden goose, and that firm MIGHT BE, HP or DELL or perhaps even NOKIA.

    I’m NOT betting on PALM itself here, PALM is a goner. I’m betting on the IP assets of PALM, being worth more to someone else, given that ANDROID now has a cloud over it.

    As with all gambles, there are risks, unknowns, and unforseen events. But isn’t that true with ANY investments we chose to make, even such “drop dead known good risks” like AAPL has show via volatility over the past two years, that luck and timing have as much to do with profits and losses, as does smart fundamental analysis?

    [ Edited: 03 March 2010 11:53 AM by TanToday ]

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    “Even in the worst of times, someone turns a profit. . ” —#162 Ferengi: Rules of Acquisition

         
  • Posted: 03 March 2010 12:42 PM #18

    There are many reasons Apple didn’t go against Palm. Too small to matter. Have a worthwhile patent portfolio of their own, and would use it viciously in an Apple initiated fight for their life. Are run by recent Apple insiders, so have both been careful not to depend on clearcut Apple IP, and are most likely to be technically astute in an IP border dispute.

         
  • Posted: 03 March 2010 02:29 PM #19

    rattyuk - 03 March 2010 02:51 PM

    I am not so convinced. [...] Palm, selling Palm handsets, haven’t made it work so far. What makes you think that a competitor could do anything better with it?

    I am not a bull on Palm; in fact I had been short since last summer until Monday.  But I’d like to tackle this question.

    Palm has one of the necessary pieces to being successful: an excellent OS.  But all of the others are either missing or in question.  The company is small relative to the market, and this creates several derivative problems.  The balance sheet is weak.  Its App Store is inadequate.  It marketing skills are demonstrably lacking.

    An acquirer that covered all or most of these holes might succeed, at least to the extent that the Palm IP would be worth more than the cost of buying it.

    Palm’s marketing strategy has been disastrous.  I commented upon this last summer and it was a major factor in my decision to go short.  Rubenstein is apparently motivated by revenge for some unseen grievance.  The initial advertising was primarily made up of attack ads on iPhone.  Brilliant.  He told Uncle Walt he had never used an iPhone.  (Run for Congress, Jon.)  Palm needed to carefully deploy its limited marketing resources, wasting nothing.  It needed to differentiate itself by carving out a market segment where its OS provided a competitive advantage.  Instead they vowed to be the iPhone Killer. 

    They have also apparently mismanaged the Verizon launch.  Small companies with glaring weaknesses cannot afford mistakes like that.

    I used to think maybe Dell was the most likely acquirer from a list of six or seven.  The list is shorter now, and Dell seems to be consolidating on its enterprise business.  Maybe HPQ.  Hurd has not been afraid to make sizable acquisitions.  But he likewise has been investing in enterprise, molding HP more in the image of IBM.

         
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    Posted: 03 March 2010 07:20 PM #20



    “In this position, you will join HTC America, Inc. at one of its most exciting phases.”

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    “Even in the worst of times, someone turns a profit. . ” —#162 Ferengi: Rules of Acquisition

         
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    Posted: 03 March 2010 10:14 PM #21

    TanToday - 03 March 2010 11:20 PM



    “In this position, you will join HTC America, Inc. at one of its most exciting phases.”

    You’re joking, right? this is a current posting?

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    Posted: 03 March 2010 10:58 PM #22

    calebcar - 04 March 2010 02:14 AM

    You’re joking, right? this is a current posting?

    Yep, legit.

    SEE FOR YOURSELF

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    “Even in the worst of times, someone turns a profit. . ” —#162 Ferengi: Rules of Acquisition

         
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    Posted: 04 March 2010 01:04 PM #23

    Some comments
    1 The law is the law, not what the public sense of justice is.
    2 Apple designed the I-phone knowing what the law is. They most likely designed the I-phone with specific tripwires in case companies reverse engineered wholesale. Apple is probably playing this game on their home court.
    3. One cost of a lawsuit is Apple being seen as a heavy, stifling competition. Apple is no longer the underdog, fighting the behemoth from Redmond.
    4. “Generally accepted practice” of using patents defensively, and the bad publicity that Apple might receive went into HTC calculations in how close to the line they went in borrowing from the I-Phone.
    5. Apple corporate DNA generally follows generally accepted practice much less than most companies, is willing to tick off the public more than most companies, and seldom does anything half way.

    We’re in for some fireworks.

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    The more I learn the higher I go,
        The higher I go the more I see;
    The more I see the less I know,
        The less I know the more I’m free.

         
  • Posted: 04 March 2010 02:25 PM #24

    1 The law is the law, not what the public sense of justice is.

    What exactly do you think a jury is?

         
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    Posted: 04 March 2010 03:05 PM #25

    calebcar - 04 March 2010 05:04 PM

    Some comments
    5. Apple corporate DNA generally follows generally accepted practice much less than most companies, is willing to tick off the public more than most companies, and seldom does anything half way.

    And don’t forget it took the brilliant legal minds at Apple almost two years to shut down 8 retards in Florida. They will be toiling against HTC for years. By the time it is settled, I safely predict that HTC will be selling more Android phones per year than Apple sells iPhones per year.

         
  • Posted: 04 March 2010 05:17 PM #26

    Che Bosco - 04 March 2010 07:05 PM

    And don’t forget it took the brilliant legal minds at Apple almost two years to shut down 8 retards in Florida. They will be toiling against HTC for years. By the time it is settled, I safely predict that HTC will be selling more Android phones per year than Apple sells iPhones per year.

    Care to elaborate? Are you saying that Apple will plunge or, as with the current Mac situation, Apple will have the top end sewn up and there will be tons of crappy pseudo smartphones around? Or are you implying that HTC will leave Apple for dead? Please, more details please.

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    Posted: 04 March 2010 05:44 PM #27

    Sure. Android handsets were shipping at a clip of 60,000 per day in mid-February according to Eric Schmidt in his MWC keynote. There are a slew of models from a bunch of manufacturers coming online. Let’s postulate, for the sake of argument, that they are crappy smart phones and that the iPhone is perfect. The Android phones sure seem good enough for 22 million people a year to buy them (at the current clip).

    But there are reasons that Android phones are better than iPhone:
    * Already available for free on contract.
    * All major carriers will be offering them, meaning that users do not lose their software investment if they must switch carriers.
    * You can still get WiFi detectors for Android.
    * Google doesn’t sensor swimsuit catalogs.

    And FWIW, even the Motorola Droid isn’t a terrible phone. I’ve played with a friend’s extensively, and I could certainly get by with it. The iPhone shines as a music player. That is still iPhone’s key advantage, not apps, especially with Apple turning into the app Taliban of late. As a phone, especially tied to AT&T, it leaves me wishing I hadn’t ditched my trusty Sanyo M1 and Sprint.

    If iPhone is going to be more than a niche product two years from now, Apple needs to have it on other carriers, needs to license the OS to other handset makers, and needs to allow unapproved apps. The competitors in the mobile space aren’t going away. Many are latching onto Android and despite all the threats to that ecosystem, it just keeps growing. Slow and steady will win this race.

         
  • Posted: 04 March 2010 05:47 PM #28

    Sure sounds like all those people who said for the Mac to succeed they will have to produce a netbook, give up the hardware manufacturing, sell the company and give the money back to the shareholders there Bosco…

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    Posted: 04 March 2010 06:01 PM #29

    Right. If 8% market share is success, you’re absolutely right rattyuk!

         
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    Posted: 04 March 2010 06:48 PM #30

    Che Bosco - 04 March 2010 07:05 PM
    calebcar - 04 March 2010 05:04 PM

    Some comments
    5. Apple corporate DNA generally follows generally accepted practice much less than most companies, is willing to tick off the public more than most companies, and seldom does anything half way.

    And don’t forget it took the brilliant legal minds at Apple almost two years to shut down 8 retards in Florida. They will be toiling against HTC for years. By the time it is settled, I safely predict that HTC will be selling more Android phones per year than Apple sells iPhones per year.

    Dish Network said the very same thing about TiVo….

    DISABLE THEM ALL, SAYS COURT

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    “Even in the worst of times, someone turns a profit. . ” —#162 Ferengi: Rules of Acquisition