Google VS Apple

  • Posted: 23 April 2011 05:04 PM #46

    BillH - 23 April 2011 06:26 PM

    The only thing that Apple can be accused of is pointing out the flawed logic and beliefs of the windows community that continues to hold the belief that windows is the superior operating system.  It’s flaws and security issues have been well documented.  The arrogant party is the one who continues to hold tight to opinions that have successfully been shown to be in error.

    arrogant |?ar?g?nt|
    adjective
    having or revealing an exaggerated sense of one’s own importance or abilities : he’s arrogant and opinionated | a typically arrogant assumption. 

    agree that apple is superior for almost all tasks in the typical windows use case, and that windows flaws and security issues generally outweigh the advantages windows holds over apple

    however the common windows user cannot comprehend the vast array of advantages that apple / ipad conveys;  they believe i am merely overstating the advantages and providing an outlier opinion.  their fear of change after 20 years of being a windows user is very strong. 

    in this case, the word is not arrogance, it is ignorance.

    even if it were possible to show people *my* so called truth as *the* truth,  and they still denied it, it would still not make them arrogant…perhaps ignorant or foolish.  tricky to defend so called truths.

         
  • Posted: 23 April 2011 07:47 PM #47

    @Steves: I’m sorry if my post forced you to write such an extended reply, but I’m not sorry that you wrote it. Some great stuff in there. As I said in my original post, I don’t know what people’s “true” attitudes toward Apple are. I’d love to see a qualified poll on the subject. I was just warning against relying too much upon “our own lying eyes”. Based on your response, you appear to have much more experience in the area than I do. You’re probably in the right.

    steves - 23 April 2011 07:43 PM

    the big elephant in the room and what i see to be the failure of many on the AFB forums is the sleeping giant MSFT/NOK.

    MSFT is about to explode on the scene, and it took me a while to confirm my belief, but I now reasonably believe they will trounce android.  it is microsoft that we need to worry about not google.  .

    this reluctant-to-switch-to-mac 89% group, who fears the unknown, with 20 years of MSFT inertia behind them, will simply prefer to go with the known - a windows phone.

    sorry to derail the thread like this, i think i should create another thread for MSFT/NOK.

    I’m one of those who has been arguing that Microsoft is in far greater danger than we know. I’d love to hear your perspective either here or in a new topic.

    It took me a long time to start hinting that Microsoft might be poised for failure and as I’ve gotten bolder and bolder in regard to the subject there’s always been a small part of me that wondered if Microsoft truly could be but a sleeping giant, waiting to awake and terrorize the mobile world. All the evidence I’ve seen from Windows Phone 7 and Microsoft’s seeming tablet strategy argues against this. But perhaps you could give me a fresh and more realistic point of view.

    If you have the time, please give us your thoughts on the subject. Based upon what you’ve written in your past few posts I’m sure that I’d learn a lot.

         
  • Posted: 23 April 2011 08:20 PM #48

    @Steves: I started a new topic on Microsoft here. I hope that you (and anyone else who is interested) will jump over there and kick-start the conversation.

    [ Edited: 23 April 2011 08:40 PM by FalKirk ]      
  • Posted: 23 April 2011 08:37 PM #49

    Tough conversation to have really.  Steve’s perspective, based on multiple decades of actual experience has a great deal of truth embedded within his central premise.  I respect that experience and accumulation of knowledge.  I really do but…,I believe it to be fundamentally flawed and have invested accordingly.  We older folk carry decades of baggage with us that is in the process of being overturned right before our very eyes and yet we continue to discuss this decades old topic.  Mac vs. PC, open vs. closed, android vs. iPhone.  Entertaining for those of us of a certain age but really, (and this is the only way to say it), the kids don’t give a shit.  They’re buying what they want and what serves their needs which in some cases is functional and some cases cultural but what difference does it make.  They’ll take them to work even if it means they have to run boot camp or Parallels and they know how.  The “truth” is in Apples financial statement and IDC’s industry papers.  Microsofts and Nokia and Dell and HP are in decline and will continue to be until they can show the world better products.  They haven’t been able to do that for years and I don’t have any reason to believe it will change anytime soon because it hasn’t.  They don’t have a single product that I want to buy.  Not one.

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    I don’t mind being wrong…,I just hate being wrong so FAST!

         
  • Posted: 23 April 2011 09:04 PM #50

    BillH - 23 April 2011 11:37 PM

    Tough conversation to have really.  Steve’s perspective, based on multiple decades of actual experience has a great deal of truth embedded within his central premise.  I respect that experience and accumulation of knowledge.  I really do but…,I believe it to be fundamentally flawed and have invested accordingly.

    Steves point of view really gave me some food for thought too. But I wonder if this is a case of the three blind men who examined an elephant. One felt the trunk and declared that the elephant was just like a snake. One felt the side and declared that an elephant was just like a wall. One felt the tail and declared that the elephant was just like a rope. From each blind man’s perspective, they accurately described the elephant. But none of them came close to actually describing the whole beast.

    It occurs to me that Steves may be fighting the good fight - trying to move people from other operating systems to Apple. Talk about a hard and thankless task. No wonder he feels that there is great resistance to Apple. In his world - from his point of view - he’s absolutely right.

    People don’t usually change their minds. They just die off and a new generation replaces them with new ideas. In today’s world, Apple is the 900 pound gorilla, Apple is the leader of the pack, Apple is who every other company is chasing. The consumers of today don’t have to be convinced that Apple’s products are any good. The don’t have to be convinced that Apple has more Apps than anyone else. They don’t have to be convinced that Apple’s products are the standard to which others aspire.

    Yes, Apple is and will continue to meet stiff resistance from the old-guard. But for the newer generation - the current generation - there is no need to convince them that Apple’s goods can do the job. It’s a given.

         
  • Posted: 23 April 2011 10:41 PM #51

    i’m replying to both your posts in the new MSFT thread.

    Lets continue all this in the new thread,

    Lets not clog up the GOOG thread.

    http://www.macobserver.com/tmo/forums/viewthread/80489/

         
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    Posted: 26 April 2011 12:42 PM #52

    adamthompson3232 - 26 April 2011 03:35 PM

    http://www.9to5mac.com/63853/developer-interest-in-ios-grows-even-as-market-for-android-smartphones-expands/

    I am telling you that we will get a better picture of Apple’s iPhone strength in 18 months.

    History is playing itself like it did with RIMM.  12 months after the iPHone came out, WS finally saw the light and RIMM started to falter.  They went from 148 straight down and never recovered.  GOOG has flatlined for the last 24 months.  Watch for a major correction in the next 18 months.

    The stock price says more about the future then the stats showing weakness in their Android plans.

         
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    Posted: 26 April 2011 12:46 PM #53

    This interesting.  I know this was mentioned in the intraday thread but it should fit here.

    I don’t know how this guy would know those numbers.

    http://tech.fortune.cnn.com/2011/04/25/analyst-15000-to-120000-xooms-sold-motorolas-survival-at-risk/

    If they only sold 120K they are in serious trouble.

         
  • Posted: 26 April 2011 02:35 PM #54

    omacvi - 26 April 2011 03:42 PM

    I am telling you that we will get a better picture of Apple’s iPhone strength in 18 months.

    History is playing itself like it did with RIMM.  12 months after the iPHone came out, WS finally saw the light and RIMM started to falter.  They went from 148 straight down and never recovered.  GOOG has flatlined for the last 24 months.  Watch for a major correction in the next 18 months.

    The stock price says more about the future then the stats showing weakness in their Android plans.

    What is the future of Android?

    1) Google is making little or no money from Android. It’s probable that Google is making as much or more from Google searches and ads that run on iOS devices as they are from those than run on Android devices. Apple probably makes twice as much in a single quarter from the sales of the iPod Touch than Google does all year from all of Android. Is the little they are making worth the effort?

    2) Android is subjecting Google to patent liabilty.

    3) In addition to the official Google marketplace, there is now a Verizon store, an Amazon store, a RIM store and a Nook store. Google is losing their leverage over Android developers.

    4) Chinese knockoffs have taken Google at their word and use Android’s open architecture to develop their own variations of Android. Sadly, for Google, these versions strip out all Google apps and all of Google’s money making potential.

    5) Google is now talking about cracking down on Manufacturers and making them toe the line. Unfortunately for Google, the Manufacturers have the exact opposite incentive. For them, it’s differentiate or die. What Google is trying to do is a Herculean task. I know Hercules. Hercules was a friend of mine. Google is no Hercules.

    So I ask again, what is the future of Android?

         
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    Posted: 26 April 2011 03:04 PM #55

    Here’s an interesting article examining what I’ve believed for some time now: Google should sell Android and focus on ads & apps on all mobile platforms.

    Android has awakened enemies. Created new ones. Android is consuming valuable resources that Google might put to better use battling Facebook head-on in social media.

    And betrayed the company’s core value.

    So I have to ask: is Android worth it? Is Android bad for Google?

    http://brianshall.com/content/android-bad-google

         
  • Posted: 26 April 2011 03:12 PM #56

    omacvi - 26 April 2011 03:46 PM

    This interesting.  I know this was mentioned in the intraday thread but it should fit here.

    I don’t know how this guy would know those numbers.

    http://tech.fortune.cnn.com/2011/04/25/analyst-15000-to-120000-xooms-sold-motorolas-survival-at-risk/

    If they only sold 120K they are in serious trouble.

    Android’s market share is irrelevant.  They don’t manufacture cell phones.  All they do is supply a component, their OS.  Their market share is apparently not helping Motorola.  Motorola’s market share IS important.  It appears that its market share is too small to compete with Apple.

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    The measure of the worth of a product is how much people are willing to pay for it, not how many people will buy it if the price is low enough.

         
  • Posted: 26 April 2011 03:17 PM #57

    Drew Bear - 26 April 2011 06:04 PM

    Here’s an interesting article examining what I’ve believed for some time now: Google should sell Android and focus on ads & apps on all mobile platforms.

    Android has awakened enemies. Created new ones. Android is consuming valuable resources that Google might put to better use battling Facebook head-on in social media.

    And betrayed the company’s core value.

    So I have to ask: is Android worth it? Is Android bad for Google?

    http://brianshall.com/content/android-bad-google

    I can’t resist cross posting this from the Asymco blog:

    The success or failure of the Android adventure of Google is still unclear. Superficially it would seem to be a success because of the large number of phones that have been sold. The free Android platform has made it possible for cell phone manufacturers to stay in business in the face of Apple’s success. Some of them are making money, others not so much. Its availability makes it harder for Microsoft to re-enter the business. But is Google making money?

    Google?s financials are opaque. The original premise was that Android phones would provide a platform for additional advertising revenue, the assumption being that this revenue would far exceed the costs of developing and maintaing the platform. There is no way of telling from the published data whether it is a huge success in this respect, a major failure, or some place in between.

    Here is a SPECULATIVE scenario. Android was Larry Page?s venture. Eric Schmidt was surprised by it, and though lukewarm gave it his best try for success. Despite this, Android was (is) not making a ton of money for Google. The problems of maintaing an ?open? system were far greater and cost a lot more money than anticipated. Eric?s approach was to try to focus more on core issues and control costs. Larry wanted to go all in, hire more people and overwhelm the problems with technology. This is only a part of the story. Page clearly wants to tackle other product areas. Hiring more people, spending more money for this as well as supporting Android is Pages approach. Being more focused and managing resources if Schmidt?s approach. Larry won the argument; after all, he (and Brin) ?own? the company.

    I may be totally wrong in my view, but this approach is not uncommon in growth companies…as long as they have money. Usually they are using someone else?s money, but in this case they have plenty of their own based on the success of their search and advertising success. Google?s pockets are very deep. Larry Page is gambling that he can ride out the short term negative impact on the bottom line and win eventually. He may, but judging from the recent reaction of Wall Street to his actions he may not have much time before the stock really gets hammered.

    So, how will it turn out? I don?t have the foggiest, but stay tuned. This has the makings of a fine soap opera.

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    The measure of the worth of a product is how much people are willing to pay for it, not how many people will buy it if the price is low enough.

         
  • Posted: 26 April 2011 06:34 PM #58

    Drew Bear - 26 April 2011 06:04 PM

    Here’s an interesting article examining what I’ve believed for some time now: Google should sell Android and focus on ads & apps on all mobile platforms.

    http://brianshall.com/content/android-bad-google

    @Drew Bear: Great link.

    westech - 26 April 2011 06:17 PM

    I can’t resist cross posting this from the Asymco blog…

    @Westech: Great post.

         
  • Posted: 26 April 2011 09:38 PM #59

    FalKirk - 26 April 2011 09:34 PM
    Drew Bear - 26 April 2011 06:04 PM

    Here’s an interesting article examining what I’ve believed for some time now: Google should sell Android and focus on ads & apps on all mobile platforms.

    http://brianshall.com/content/android-bad-google

    @Drew Bear: Great link.

    westech - 26 April 2011 06:17 PM

    I can’t resist cross posting this from the Asymco blog…

    @Westech: Great post.

    Thanks.

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    The measure of the worth of a product is how much people are willing to pay for it, not how many people will buy it if the price is low enough.

         
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    Posted: 28 April 2011 12:15 PM #60

    The Android OS lost ground for the first time since Q2 2009, falling to 50 percent of smartphone unit sales in Q1 2011 compared to 53 percent in the prior quarter. Apple iOS share rose 9 percentage points to comprise 28 percent of smartphone unit sales. Research In Motion?s BlackBerry OS also lost ground, falling 5 points, to 14 percent.


    This is playing out like RIMM in 2008.  3 years from now or sooner the landscape will change drastically for Android.

    The impact the iPhone will have on Android phones will start slowly and under the radar.  But as Apple adds more carriers and introduces better and better iPhones, it will be more clear as the iPad really takes off next year that iOS will swallow Android for lunch in two short years.