Dividend Details

  • Posted: 17 July 2012 04:25 PM

    Anybody know the exact dividend dates like ex-dividend date and the payment date?

    Due to my impending retirement I’ll be wanting to take the few hundred AAPL shares that are in the Hewitt accounts that my employer forces us to use and roll them to my E-Trade IRA account.  Due to the complete lack of any clues on Hewitt’s part I can’t just roll the shares.  I have to actually SELL them, wait for settlement (6 business days according to these idiots) and then transfer the money to my non-self-directed Hewitt account, where only mutual funds are available.  Then, and only then can I roll the cash into E-Trade and buy back my AAPL shares. The whole process is likely to take weeks and could cost me tens of thousands in missed appreciation.

    I’ve complained directly to our HR VP about Hewitt and their clumsy, cumbersome, don’t-give-a-sh*t system.  They are in the process of instituting some recommended changes, but I’m on my way out the door and I’ve had it with Hewitt.  Never, ever go near these people if you can help it.

    Sorry for the rant.  It would be very helpful if I knew the ex-dividend date, especially.

    [ Edited: 18 July 2012 03:10 PM by Zeke ]      
  • Posted: 17 July 2012 05:03 PM #1

    Ex-dividend and payment dates have not been announced yet. Hoping for the information next Tuesday.

         
  • Posted: 18 July 2012 01:55 PM #2

    Zeke, I have a parallel problem, though arising from different circumstances and with a different time gap.

    I want to avoid receiving the dividend.  So I will sell all my shares at 3:59pm on the eve of ex-date.  Then I will buy them back at 9:31am on ex-date. 

    My problem is that the opening price on ex-date may be higher than the price I sold at.  My solution is that I am going to buy ITM options with delta equal to my shares at the same time as I sell the shares.  Then in the morning, I’ll sell the options simultaneous with buying back the shares.  Theta losses should be negligible.  Commissions will be modest. Bid/ask friction will cost a tad.  My biggest risk would seem to be a big drop in IV overnight.

    Can anybody poke holes in this?

         
  • Posted: 18 July 2012 03:13 PM #3

    capablanca - 18 July 2012 04:55 PM

    Zeke, I have a parallel problem, though arising from different circumstances and with a different time gap.

    I want to avoid receiving the dividend.  So I will sell all my shares at 3:59pm on the eve of ex-date.  Then I will buy them back at 9:31am on ex-date. 

    My problem is that the opening price on ex-date may be higher than the price I sold at.  My solution is that I am going to buy ITM options with delta equal to my shares at the same time as I sell the shares.  Then in the morning, I’ll sell the options simultaneous with buying back the shares.  Theta losses should be negligible.  Commissions will be modest. Bid/ask friction will cost a tad.  My biggest risk would seem to be a big drop in IV overnight.

    Can anybody poke holes in this?

    I don’t see any, and your options could go up overnight.  I have no option but to go to cash and sit on it for a couple of weeks.:-(

         
  • Posted: 18 July 2012 04:04 PM #4

    capablanca - 18 July 2012 04:55 PM

    Zeke, I have a parallel problem, though arising from different circumstances and with a different time gap.

    I want to avoid receiving the dividend.  So I will sell all my shares at 3:59pm on the eve of ex-date.  Then I will buy them back at 9:31am on ex-date. 

    My problem is that the opening price on ex-date may be higher than the price I sold at.  My solution is that I am going to buy ITM options with delta equal to my shares at the same time as I sell the shares.  Then in the morning, I’ll sell the options simultaneous with buying back the shares.  Theta losses should be negligible.  Commissions will be modest. Bid/ask friction will cost a tad.  My biggest risk would seem to be a big drop in IV overnight.

    Can anybody poke holes in this?

    For what reason do you not want the dividend that you are willing to go through all the trouble every quarter?  Since you would be selling and buying the stock numerous times every year, I assume it’s not a tax issue, so I am stumped as to other reasons.

         
  • Posted: 18 July 2012 08:58 PM #5

    Sammy the Walrus IV - 18 July 2012 07:04 PM
    capablanca - 18 July 2012 04:55 PM

    Zeke, I have a parallel problem, though arising from different circumstances and with a different time gap.

    I want to avoid receiving the dividend.  So I will sell all my shares at 3:59pm on the eve of ex-date.  Then I will buy them back at 9:31am on ex-date. 

    My problem is that the opening price on ex-date may be higher than the price I sold at.  My solution is that I am going to buy ITM options with delta equal to my shares at the same time as I sell the shares.  Then in the morning, I’ll sell the options simultaneous with buying back the shares.  Theta losses should be negligible.  Commissions will be modest. Bid/ask friction will cost a tad.  My biggest risk would seem to be a big drop in IV overnight.

    Can anybody poke holes in this?

    For what reason do you not want the dividend that you are willing to go through all the trouble every quarter?  Since you would be selling and buying the stock numerous times every year, I assume it’s not a tax issue, so I am stumped as to other reasons.

    Oh, but it is a tax issue.  Complex beyond what would be of interest here, but speaking generally the dividend is a bad thing for most ordinary people (as opposed to institutions) who own a lot of shares outside a retirement account.

    The so-called cliff is an exacerbating factor.  It is my hope that this won’t be necessary every quarter.

         
  • Posted: 18 July 2012 09:48 PM #6

    @Capablanca:

    This may be reminiscent of “I’ve got a Secret”. I’ll ask questions until you answer in the negative. Is this a U.S. tax problem? Yes? Ok. You’re willing to report short-term capital gains on the amount of the dividend every quarter rather than pay taxes at the somewhat reduced dividend tax rate? Yes? Ok. Why?

         
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    Posted: 19 July 2012 12:04 AM #7

    Zeke - 17 July 2012 07:25 PM

    I’ve complained directly to our HR VP about Hewitt and their clumsy, cumbersome, don’t-give-a-sh*t system.  They are in the process of instituting some recommended changes, but I’m on my way out the door and I’ve had it with Hewitt.  Never, ever go near these people if you can help it.

    Hewitt manages the benefits website for the company I work for. I tried to do a partial rollover of funds to an IRA a couple months ago, and it can’t do it because my account number has letters and numbers in it, when it only wants a numerical account number. Seriously?

         
  • Posted: 19 July 2012 12:00 PM #8

    nkmho - 19 July 2012 03:04 AM
    Zeke - 17 July 2012 07:25 PM

    I’ve complained directly to our HR VP about Hewitt and their clumsy, cumbersome, don’t-give-a-sh*t system.  They are in the process of instituting some recommended changes, but I’m on my way out the door and I’ve had it with Hewitt.  Never, ever go near these people if you can help it.

    Hewitt manages the benefits website for the company I work for. I tried to do a partial rollover of funds to an IRA a couple months ago, and it can’t do it because my account number has letters and numbers in it, when it only wants a numerical account number. Seriously?

    Yes, that sounds about right.  It’s the kind of thing you run into with them at every turn.  It’s like they are completely unaware of the rest of the world and its procedures.  I can’t say enough bad things about Hewitt.

         
  • Posted: 19 July 2012 01:06 PM #9

    gdavid - 19 July 2012 12:48 AM

    @Capablanca:

    This may be reminiscent of “I’ve got a Secret”. I’ll ask questions until you answer in the negative. Is this a U.S. tax problem? Yes? Ok. You’re willing to report short-term capital gains on the amount of the dividend every quarter rather than pay taxes at the somewhat reduced dividend tax rate? Yes? Ok. Why?

    No. 

    Having said that, I cannot predict what actions will be appropriate in future quarters under now unknown future U.S. and state tax law.