Chuck Joiner Interviews Dave Hamilton After WWDC19

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The Mac Observer’s Dave Hamilton recently appeared on Chuck Joiner’s MacVoices show. Fresh from WWDC19, Mr. Hamilton talks about first impressions of the new Mac Pro (and its intended market), macOS Catalina a geek’s perspective (like the separate system volume), and HomeKit-enabled routers. I liked his perspective on the Mac Pro. The thousand-dollar stand got most of the media attention, but it’s a pro device for specific audiences, such as videographers. There’s a reason why Apple kept comparing the Pro Display XDR to a US$43,000 Sony monitor. Mr. Hamilton also knows routers well, and how Apple is acknowledging that other companies do networking hardware better.

10 Comments Add a comment

  1. Kelly Guimont

    Hey John, clearly you didn’t listen to my interview with Chuck (: I said that I’m mostly excited about this new Mac Pro because I think Apple will take what they learned making this one and it will trickle down to the mere mortal machines in the lineup.

    What the haters were crying out for wasn’t horsepower, it was modularity. That’s a valid stance, where “oh it has all the horsepower and all the gfx processing but it’s ‘just’ an iMac” is not.

    Did you just set me up to write an editorial about this? (:

    • John Kheit

      Hi Kelly. I have not yet listened to your interview. I think you mixed posts/threads. I was responding to the Dave H interview above.

  2. John Kheit

    Also, it is not good that apple is out of the router market. Apple could make router that protects privacy. Like make every apple router an auto-magic VPN that your iOS devices auto route through your AppleID automagically. And homekit integration. And so many other things that other companies are not trustworthy over.

    If you believe apple takes privacy seriously, and that real software people make their own hardware like apple trots out that phrase so often, then all of us should be pushing them to make routers again.

    And also, a non marie-antoinette-tone-deaf-let-them-eat-cake monitor at a decent price. Like the iMac 5k display just as a display. You know, because Mac Mini owners are people too that deserve a screen too.

  3. John Kheit

    Couldnt disagree more. Everyone telling enthusiasts you don’t need a machine at $3000 with the ability to expand using slots is apologist to apple’s marie-antoinette-tone-deaf-let-them-eat-cake positioning of the Mac Pro. Too many apologies. Same apolgies that told me how great the trashcan was and we should be happy with what a well thought out design that was. It’s a failure of pundits not to call it as it is. That machine is a PROVEN failure and apple ‘fessed to that much. Apple was a FURTHER failure in taking so long even after then to get this machine out. And Apple has again failed to produce a machine that many enthusiasts want. A machine like the Mac Pro, maybe with some less horsepower, but ultimately with expansion slots, that costs around $3000. Similar to the original Mac Pro that came out in 2006 at $2500.

    Which brings me to further BS in the positions from above. The Enthusiasts were asking for a machine like that original Mac Pro, which came out at 2500 price point. It’s disingenuous to say apple gave them what they wanted at a price point more than 2x that amount (even adjusted for inflation). And that the pundits apologize for this rather than call apple out only retard them course correcting like when enough of the non pundits complained that apple failed them with the traschan mac.

    The pricing of the Mac Pro is an utter failure. It ignores the core of the apple market that saved apple in 2006. It wasnt the well heeled ‘pros’ it was the enthusiasts that saved apple. And apple just gave the enthusiasts the finger with this latest mac pro.

    • Dave Hamilton

      I think you’re missing out on all the other desktop Macs in the market. Apple’s new Mac Pro isn’t for the people who have an emotional need for a machine with “Pro” in its name. It’s for the people who actually need a beast of a Mac.

      For everyone else Apple is clearly communicating what’s been obvious to many of us for a while: most of the folks who formerly needed a “Mac Pro” are very well-served by a Mac mini, an iMac, or an iMac Pro, in that order.

      Look at the top-of-the-line 2013 Mac Pro. Today’s i7 Mac mini at $1300 is faster than that machine. And you can add any GPU you want to it, and anything else external. Most of us don’t need slots anymore: we have Thunderbolt (and have, for a long time). Think of that as “external PCI” if that’s easier.

      With 2019’s Mac Pro Apple filled a hole in their lineup that was actually sending people to other platforms because there was no Mac capable enough to get those jobs done.

      All the other jobs? Well, that’s what all the other Macs are for.

      This Mac Pro is not for you.

      • John Kheit

        This is so much hindsight rationlization. For many, it was “obvious to many” that the traschcan was a the great new direction. Those “many” ignored, IMO, more rational voices that criticized it brutally like it deserved. SO this is rinse in and repeat.

        You can hold your breath all you like, and apple can too. The reality is the original mac pro came out at $2500. It let a lot of enthusiasts get what THEY WANTED (not what you nor apple think they should want, or should be ‘good enough’ by your judgement) but what THEY WANT. Which is an expandable Mac Pro at a price point mere mortals can get into.

        No amount of handwaving and rationalization will change that. It’s only more “all apologies” hindsight analysis.

        And comparing the mac mini to the failed traschcan, both of which do not offer expandability that enthusiasts want, is totally missing the point.

        The laughable thing is Bryan always accuses me of only talking to my own selfish needs, which he’s accurate about 99% of the time. 😀 But in this case, it is for me. I can afford to max out the mac pro. But that is irreverent (and frankly not for you to say what is and is not for me).

        What is relevant is that apple is ignoring its core enthusiast market and what it wants. That you are not concerned that its core enthusiast market is bummed out is tone deafness on the order of apple. And those that ‘backed’ apple’s tone deafness on the traschcan mac were on the wrong side of history. Being tone deaf on enthusiasts here, is on that same wrong side.

      • John Kheit

        Funny though. The “computer for the rest of us”, “it’s not for you”. If enough enthusiasts believe it, it just might come true.

      • Dave Hamilton

        John Kheit: “This is so much hindsight rationlization.”

        Not only is that not fair, it’s not accurate. You clearly haven’t been listening to Mac Geek Gab where, for years, I’ve been saying that the Mac Pro audience already has the machines that they want… they’re just not called “Mac Pro” anymore.

      • John Kheit

        Well if that were true for years, I guess the new mac pro is nugatory and a mistake since they have all they wanted already.

        The enthusiast market wants slots and upgradability. That used to be possible with a Mac Pro for as low as $2000 when it first came out. Now it’s only possible for $6k. That is a mistake. You telling people on Geek Gab or otherwise they should be happy with that lot doesn’t make it so.

        We can agree to disagree. But like in the past, I’m right on this. Apple is ignoring its core enthusiasts that want a mac with slots and dont want to take a 2nd mortgage to get it. Apologizing and rationalizing on Apple’s behalf rather than criticizing that decision will only lengthen the pain, and increase the size of that exodus.

        It’s one thing to direct people in that segment to other options that might serve them, it’s another to tell them “you should be happy with this and i/we know what you need/want better than you”.

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